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Old 06.07.2015, 01:40 AM   #1
Keeping It Gimple
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buzzo aka the only sane man in a world gone mad has waded in on montage of heck:

http://thetalkhouse.com/music/talks/...melvins-talks/

I love documentaries. I can watch a documentary about anything. But I didn’t have much interest in this one —I’ve had my fill of Kurt Cobain and Nirvana bios and documentaries, and stopped reading and watching them a long time ago. I don’t have a lot of happy memories about any of that stuff, and the nice things I do remember are clouded by a deeply depressing fog of pointless misery. Look how it all ended.

Nonetheless, I sat through Montage of Heck twice.

I went to high school with Kurt and was a big part of all the Nirvana guys’ lives before and after they became famous. I thought very highly of Kurt, Krist and Dave. We were good friends when they were all flat broke, long before they could buy big houses and cars with credit cards. My band played with Nirvana at their last show. I was there for the beginning and I was there for the end, for the very good and the very bad.

First off, people need to understand that 90% of Montage of Heck is bullshit. Total bullshit. That’s the one thing no one gets about Cobain — he was a master of jerking your chain.

For instance, I know the whole “I tried to fuck a fat retard” story is complete bullshit. Not even an inkling of truth. That’s too good a story to have gone this long without me hearing about it, especially if, as he suggests, the girl’s father freaked out about it at the high school. In that small-town shit-hole, exciting news of that nature would have been common knowledge before the sun set. It never happened. And the trying-to-kill-himself-on-the-train-tracks story is bullshit as well. It never happened either. There it is, though, told in a recording of Kurt’s own voice so it must be true…right? Wrong.

Kurt also told me there was absolutely nothing wrong with his stomach. He made it up for sympathy and so he could use it as an excuse to stay loaded. Of course he was vomiting — that’s what people on heroin do, they vomit. It’s called “vomiting with a smile on your face.”

At least they spared us the horrendously overblowUnfortunately, it matters very little what the facts are; what matters is what people believe. And when it comes to Cobain, most of what they believe is fabricated nonsense.n tale of him living under a bridge in Aberdeen. Another bullshit story. As far as I know, Kurt never set foot under any bridge in that town, let alone lived under one. That whole idea is romanticized crazy-talk for glassy-eyed, stoned teenagers and pathetic, middle-aged, rock & roll morons.

And then there’s Courtney.

A lot of what she says in this documentary doesn’t exactly jibe with things Kurt told me himself, but I suppose that’s not surprising when you consider history becomes elastic every time Courtney Love opens her mouth.

For instance, she’d have us believe that Kurt tried to off himself when she’d only thought about cheating on him?

Wow. That’s a whole lot different from the stories he told me in regards to Courtney’s behavior — and this was well before he ended up dead. And that’s just one example.

When Courtney speaks, the truth is certainly there, but God only knows where it begins and ends. In the 20 years since Kurt’s death, the undisputed facts of some of her stories seem to change almost hourly. I remain unconvinced in regards to her testimony, and I don’t think I’m alone.

I find it amusing that the filmmakers never bothered to fact-check simple stuff like this, and just took Kurt and Courtney at their word. That’s a bit risky when you’re supposed to be making a behind-the-scenes documentary — but not surprising considering that not a lot of what’s out there about Kurt is the truth anyway. But no one seems to care. Unfortunately, it matters very little what the facts are; what matters is what people believe. And when it comes to Cobain, most of what they believe is fabricated nonsense. Montage of Heck does nothing to counter that. With that in mind, it’s really hard to take any of this film seriously.

After 49 minutes, I was ready for it all to be over, but Montage of Heck just went on and on, and oh, what a treat it was….

I got to see Kurt in creepy home movies, and Courtney nude, which, for me, was akin to staring into the sun. I got to see behind the curtain and right up close — two malodorous, doped-up rock & roll miscreants deeply fouling an unsuspecting apartment. Jesus! There stands a half-naked Kurt shaving, and right behind his back, his wife is parading around, showing off her naked breasts and pouting to the cameraman, who I’m guessing was Eric Erlandson, ex-Hole guitarist and Courtney’s former boyfriend. Really? Kurt probably had to deal with horseshit like that on a daily basis. My god, what a super-colossal drag.

I suppose this movie will be interesting for Nirvana completists, because it certainly reinforces their already twisted view of the man. I found it to be mostly misguided fiction.

Not a happy experience.

I did enjoy the really cool animation, though, and they did a fantastic job of showing what a depressing shit-hole Aberdeen really was and still is. For that, I salute them!
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Old 06.07.2015, 07:21 AM   #2
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So?
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Old 06.07.2015, 07:45 AM   #3
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I've enjoyed the animations in the movie too. Nirvana belonged to the mainstream anyway, which is not a bad position to be in if you're a great band. It only becomes irksome when you are viewed as THE SHIT in an environment you distanced yourself from one way or another. Add misjudged political pontification involving racism and gender and rather than posing as a mirror to society you are just staring at the crude machinations of useless vanity. Yes, you defend ethnic minorities. Yes, you defend the ''alternative'' sexualities. Yes, you defend the depressed and weak. Nowhere you mention that all those people may not need your ''charity''.
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Old 06.07.2015, 11:47 AM   #4
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I read the King Buzzo piece, if MOH was mostly bullshit why was Krist involved? Wouldn't anyone Nirvana fan believe that if anyone knew who Kurt was better than anyone it was Krist? If he didn't think the truth of Kurt was being represented by the filmmakers would he have anything to do with it? Obviously even when dealing with a documentary the filmmakers are telling a narrative, and certainly you can argue that MOH is just as much an art film as it is a series of video footage and so called diary excerts, but if I were a man's so-called best friend and I thought the filmmakers were not being truthful about them I'd be the first to say "fuck you".
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Old 06.07.2015, 05:04 PM   #5
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he might not have known what was true or what wasnt or he might have just been interviewed. also he just generally doesnt go into those kind of things but has said before that a lot of kurts tales were fabrications.

everything buzzo says stacks up with what we already knew.

the whole thing is covered in romantic bs and its good that buzzo called it for what it is.
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Old 06.07.2015, 05:14 PM   #6
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In all seriousness, I still say, So?, to this whole thing. This from one "who was there" and who was a fan even before Nevermind. I guess it makes me go "meh" the way the plethora of bootlegs long ago started to sound all the same. Great. And, boring. We've been there, we've done this, music has moved on. Christ, while we're at it, let's go watch Gimme Shelter for the 20th time.
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Old 06.07.2015, 05:33 PM   #7
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Christ

i think you meant "Krist"
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Old 06.07.2015, 06:19 PM   #8
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i think you meant "Krist"

I repped you!
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Old 06.08.2015, 01:04 AM   #9
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The reality is, and while I trust Buzz's take on things, is that not everyone knows everything about everyone. I always doubted the "bridge" story as well, but then again he obviously knew that the bridge was there, and whose to say whether he spent time there or not? Unless Buzz followed him around 24/7 (which did not happen) there is no way for he himself to be certain. How many people have discovered after knowing someone for a number of years that they were gay, or maybe had a hidden drug issue, anything? People tend to be full of surprises. But yeah....lots of the "mythology" surrounding Kurt has been debunked through the years and these clarifications are there/available to anyone who cares about facts and what not. I like the myths. I like the facts, too. Art isn't always about the facts and sometimes the "stories", true or false, aid in keeping things interesting. Give the listener/viewer further ideas to ponder when observing. I've never really felt that the truth should get in the way of a good story. Not always, anyway. I mean, why? I think some of these stories have probably helped people in indirect ways. Younger people who needed to believe that this guy had been through certain things they could identify with when turning to the music as a means of escapism OR to feel as if someone, somewhere, could identify with whatever it was they themselves were experiencing. Nirvana was very bright and happy. Nirvana was very dark and fucked up. They are many things to many different people and I think this is largely why the world hasn't forgotten them and we're still, after all these years, sitting around chatting about this stuff.
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Old 06.08.2015, 02:34 PM   #10
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I liked Montage regardless of its depressing approach. Glad buzzo shared his insider perspective though, indeed i miss his posting
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Old 06.08.2015, 04:58 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
indeed i miss his posting


The King Buzzo who wrote that article is the guy from The Melvins, the king buzzo who posted in this board was some teenage kid from who knows where. You know that, right?
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Old 06.08.2015, 05:09 PM   #12
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Ha ha. I'm really Kim Gordon. You know that, right?

gmk is a backwards code for kim gordon (see the k, m, and g). I threw the u in there to confuse people.
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Old 06.09.2015, 09:36 PM   #13
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I just watched this last night. I found the footage with Francis to be very disturbing. Its cute at first until you realize Kurt and Courtney are on heroin while there playing with her. Then it gets really sad and made me very angry at them. FRANCIS DESERVES BETTER. I thought Kurdt was smarter than that. But hes not, hes a goddamn idiot. He was no genius. Courtney is lying as usual about not cheating on him. Courtney made a Junkies promise with Kurdt when he was still alive to keep their secret a secret and to never tell anyone. We will never know the truth because Courtney promised Kurdt she would never tell. She will take Kurdts secrets to the grave and never tell anyone. The secret truth about Kurt Cobain he didnt want his fans to know is that the "Real Kurdt" is more like the Courtney Love everybody HATES and nothing like the Kurt Cobain his fans "LOVE". If every Nirvana fan knew who the "real Kurdt" was they would hate him as much as they hate Courtney. If Kim Gordon knew the real kurdt was more like the Courtney Love she hates she wouldnt want to know him or be protective of him. Kurt was living a double life and the truth was he was just like Courtney and the "Kurt" he played to fans never really existed. The Kurt he pretended to be to Sonic Youth was never the real kurt. Courtney is the only person who knew the real kurt. People ask what did Kurt see in Courtney? And my answer to that is ? HIMSELF !!!! Kurt saw HIMSELF in Courtney in a way no one else did. They were an IDENTICAL MATCH. The media tried to play it off like Opposites Attract. That was total bullshit. They were just like each other. Kurt was just as horrible, selfish, greedy, shallow, superficial, arrogant, and self loathing as Courtney was but he never gets blamed for it because hes so SUCCESSFUL !!! It sickens me how everyone turned a blind eye to his behavior because of his success. Courtney always takes the blame when Kurt was just as irresponsible and shitty as she was. Courtney played the villain so he could live a double life. She went along with the "myth" to cover up his double life of being just as horrible as her. This documentary disposes the "myths" and shows how horrible kurt really was. Kurt is really Courtney on a drug binge u dont want to deal with. There goes the fucking myths out the fucking window. Kim Gordon's book perpetuates Kurts myth as being a patron saint and Courtney the villain. The truth is Kim never really knew the real kurt and the real kurt was worse than Courtney. Only Courtney saw the real kurt we will never see. Courtney is the only person he could be himself around and not Kim Gordon. Kim Gordon fell for the myth just like every Nirvana fan in the world. I find her depiction of Kurt to be too similar to the myth he really wasnt. As far as Buzzo's goes, his perception is out of wack. Brett Morgan put those myths in the documentary to dissolve them and not to perpetuate them. I dont care what Buzzo thinks, Kurt was never the "real Kurt" to Buzzo anyways. He was only the "Real Kurt" to Courtney.
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Old 06.10.2015, 01:51 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyboyz
I just watched this last night. I found the footage with Francis to be very disturbing. Its cute at first until you realize Kurt and Courtney are on heroin while there playing with her. Then it gets really sad and made me very angry at them. FRANCIS DESERVES BETTER. I thought Kurdt was smarter than that. But hes not, hes a goddamn idiot. He was no genius. Courtney is lying as usual about not cheating on him. Courtney made a Junkies promise with Kurdt when he was still alive to keep their secret a secret and to never tell anyone. We will never know the truth because Courtney promised Kurdt she would never tell. She will take Kurdts secrets to the grave and never tell anyone. The secret truth about Kurt Cobain he didnt want his fans to know is that the "Real Kurdt" is more like the Courtney Love everybody HATES and nothing like the Kurt Cobain his fans "LOVE". If every Nirvana fan knew who the "real Kurdt" was they would hate him as much as they hate Courtney. If Kim Gordon knew the real kurdt was more like the Courtney Love she hates she wouldnt want to know him or be protective of him. Kurt was living a double life and the truth was he was just like Courtney and the "Kurt" he played to fans never really existed. The Kurt he pretended to be to Sonic Youth was never the real kurt. Courtney is the only person who knew the real kurt. People ask what did Kurt see in Courtney? And my answer to that is ? HIMSELF !!!! Kurt saw HIMSELF in Courtney in a way no one else did. They were an IDENTICAL MATCH. The media tried to play it off like Opposites Attract. That was total bullshit. They were just like each other. Kurt was just as horrible, selfish, greedy, shallow, superficial, arrogant, and self loathing as Courtney was but he never gets blamed for it because hes so SUCCESSFUL !!! It sickens me how everyone turned a blind eye to his behavior because of his success. Courtney always takes the blame when Kurt was just as irresponsible and shitty as she was. Courtney played the villain so he could live a double life. She went along with the "myth" to cover up his double life of being just as horrible as her. This documentary disposes the "myths" and shows how horrible kurt really was. Kurt is really Courtney on a drug binge u dont want to deal with. There goes the fucking myths out the fucking window. Kim Gordon's book perpetuates Kurts myth as being a patron saint and Courtney the villain. The truth is Kim never really knew the real kurt and the real kurt was worse than Courtney. Only Courtney saw the real kurt we will never see. Courtney is the only person he could be himself around and not Kim Gordon. Kim Gordon fell for the myth just like every Nirvana fan in the world. I find her depiction of Kurt to be too similar to the myth he really wasnt. As far as Buzzo's goes, his perception is out of wack. Brett Morgan put those myths in the documentary to dissolve them and not to perpetuate them. I dont care what Buzzo thinks, Kurt was never the "real Kurt" to Buzzo anyways. He was only the "Real Kurt" to Courtney.

Look at you with your insider information.


EVERYONE has secrets. NO ONE is the same person all the time. And if Kurt was "just like" Courtney, she'd be dead too. Obviously they are (eh..."were") different people. Everyone has good/bad sides. Most tend to be somewhat different around different people as different people tend to bring out different elements of us that are not always obvious.


And again, as usual, you have no idea what you are talking about.
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Old 06.10.2015, 03:57 AM   #15
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Look at you with your insider information.

Is insider information a new euphemism for psychotic ramblings?
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Old 06.10.2015, 04:16 AM   #16
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Kurt would have hated this thread.
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Old 06.10.2015, 08:07 AM   #17
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Nirvana hype was manufactured by the Mad Men.
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Old 06.10.2015, 08:07 AM   #18
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If Nirvana were black or Hispanic no one would care
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Old 06.10.2015, 08:14 AM   #19
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I always say, if you wanna die, do so after your child is old enough to come to grips with it, or at least get to know you a bit.
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Old 06.10.2015, 08:16 AM   #20
Rob Instigator
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Rob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's assesRob Instigator kicks all y'all's asses
If only Kurt had followed Eric Clapton's lead and just done heroin quietly for 30 years, all the while building up endless respect among older white folks which would allow him to do more heroin....

fuck Eric Clapton
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