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Old 12.20.2017, 04:13 PM   #4841
Severian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by !@#$%!
i first read cien años when i was 12 or 13 but it was in spanish so i did not need the anthropological mediation of an education to get it immediately.

unlike most things i read at that age, i have kept coming back to it over the decades and it's never old.

shakespeare funny enough i like better in translation than in english, because i have difficulty with his brilliant but for me inaccessible turns of expression, so instead of appearing luminous they register in my reduced ability as overwrought and self-conscious, and ultimately alienate me. i don't blame him for it, the problem is my painful lack of intimacy with the language--in other words too much friction and i need vaseline ha ha ha. so yeah, i'd rather read shakespeare in smooth translation where i can better grasp his psychological genius rather than his verbal virtuosity. my loss, i know, but best i can do.


Wait, is English not your first language? Either way, you are better at using it than a vast majority of human beings on the planet. I have trouble believing that’s Shakespeare would vex you at all.

But yeah... reading Shakespeare isn’t the most exciting thing. Experiencing his work, however you do it, is better than just sitting at home reading the compete works or whatever.
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Old 12.20.2017, 04:33 PM   #4842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Severian
Wait, is English not your first language? Either way, you are better at using it than a vast majority of human beings on the planet. I have trouble believing that’s Shakespeare would vex you at all.

But yeah... reading Shakespeare isn’t the most exciting thing. Experiencing his work, however you do it, is better than just sitting at home reading the compete works or whatever.
i used to go to the shakespeare theater in dc (cheap standing room tix) and not have a fucking clue what went on.

best way for me to get shakespeare in english (no joke) is to watch it as a movie with subtitles. i most remember macbeth as the laurence olivier version from a library vhs tape ha ha ha. and richard III was... the guy who plays loki.hiddles... something. NONONONONO... henry IV, that’s right. and the guy who plays falstaff in it is the greatest.

i do have a ba in english and attended a shakespeare class... for like 2 sessions. it was a bunch of political theory bullshit. i wanted an appreciation not the sociological autopsy of a so-called dead white man.

but yeah, no, reading it in spanish is awesome, h ah ha. othello blew my mind when i was a teenager. i should do it again soon.
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Old 12.20.2017, 05:38 PM   #4843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by !@#$%!
i used to go to the shakespeare theater in dc (cheap standing room tix) and not have a fucking clue what went on.

best way for me to get shakespeare in english (no joke) is to watch it as a movie with subtitles. i most remember macbeth as the laurence olivier version from a library vhs tape ha ha ha. and richard III was... the guy who plays loki.hiddles... something. NONONONONO... henry IV, that’s right. and the guy who plays falstaff in it is the greatest.

i do have a ba in english and attended a shakespeare class... for like 2 sessions. it was a bunch of political theory bullshit. i wanted an appreciation not the sociological autopsy of a so-called dead white man.

but yeah, no, reading it in spanish is awesome, h ah ha. othello blew my mind when i was a teenager. i should do it again soon.

Have you ever seen Orson Welles’ “MacBeth?” It’s pretty goddamn great. He did an “Othello” too (and a “Merchant of Venice” but I’ve neber seen those.

What made me interested in Shakespeare was reading “King Lear” in a high school English class. We didn’t have an AP program until my junior year, so I was stuck in regular English with the other kids and the kind-of-dumb teacher who basically used a CliffNotes version of the thing. I read the real play on my own and it blew me the fuck away. Like... OK, every political drama ever can go ahead and call this thing Daddy.”

Orson Welles’ MacBeth is badass though.

I’ve had difficulty with other Shakespeare film adaptations. Very hard to make appealing. Hard to bring the weight of the tragedy or comedy into a modern setting without totally fucking it all to hell.
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Old 12.20.2017, 05:46 PM   #4844
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oh man man man my first king lear was kurosawa’s RAN.

i still watch it every so often. a glorious fucking movie. from the very first shot.

it’s an amazing version.

watch it on a good screen. for tv, plasma works, or one of the new UHDs that don’t wash out the image like a soap opera. the cinematography is out of this world.

haven’t seen the orson welles macbeth but his touch of evil is as disturbing as the scottish play. maybe more as it features charlton heston in brownface. but i’ll keep an eye out for it— i really love welles’s films

anyway the bbc did some of the histories with a series called “the hollow crown” and they were great. i think you can trust the bbc with period pieces— it’s all they do!
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Old 12.21.2017, 12:37 PM   #4845
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Old 12.21.2017, 04:05 PM   #4846
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For the Marquez-heads http://www.dw.com/en/gabriel-garcia-...xas/a-41751099

Archive put online for free by Univ of Texas

that’s awesome! thanks!

i was aware that utexas had the archives but didn’t know that they had put it all up online and free for the public. which is brilliant.
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Old 12.22.2017, 05:20 PM   #4847
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and fuck Charles Dickens. Praising Dickens for his writing skill in 2017 is like praising Stephen king for his writing skill in 2117. Dickens was a fucking mass-market writer, selling salami to the masses just like Stephen King.
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Old 12.23.2017, 12:30 AM   #4848
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Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
and fuck Charles Dickens. Praising Dickens for his writing skill in 2017 is like praising Stephen king for his writing skill in 2117. Dickens was a fucking mass-market writer, selling salami to the masses just like Stephen King.

Yeah they’re exactly the same. You nailed it. World wrong, you right (again).
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Old 12.23.2017, 06:51 AM   #4849
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I don't think people read Dickens now for his way with words, which is incredibly bloated at times, at least by today's standards, but for his creation of characters that seem to have near universal relevance, and for his social conscious. We can all play the game of dismissing a great writer on purely formal, medium specific grounds, but we dismiss a lot of great writers that way and end up celebrating a lot of mediocre ones in their place.
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Old 12.23.2017, 09:27 AM   #4850
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He had some great character portraits, which is what I liked about him. You may as well say Shakespeare and Dostoevski were hacks; they did "popular fiction for the masses", too
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Old 12.23.2017, 09:53 AM   #4851
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Quote:
Originally Posted by demonrail666
I don't think people read Dickens now for his way with words, which is incredibly bloated at times, at least by today's standards, but for his creation of characters that seem to have near universal relevance, and for his social conscious. We can all play the game of dismissing a great writer on purely formal, medium specific grounds, but we dismiss a lot of great writers that way and end up celebrating a lot of mediocre ones in their place.

Exactly — though the social consciousness of his work has come under some scrutiny, I’m not about to dismiss it. It’s important to remember that Dickens was one of the most famous human beings in the world while he was writing, and he stil (often, at least) chose to focus his stories on the day-to-day lives of the British working class and ruined ex-aristocratic families, struggling with love and legacy and so on.

He’d be “woke” by today’s standards. But we can’t really evaluate Dickens on 2017 standards, because the literary world has been so flooded for so long with disciples and disciples of disiples that, like Shakespeare of the Beatles, his influence has been so vast that it makes his own work seem almost derivative. Just because he influenced essentially every Westwrn novelist to lift a pen.

And his character construction is masterful. His prose may feel quaint or “boring” at times, to some, with no perspective. But fuck that noise.
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Old 12.23.2017, 09:55 AM   #4852
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilduclo
He had some great character portraits, which is what I liked about him. You may as well say Shakespeare and Dostoevski were hacks; they did "popular fiction for the masses", too

Yep yep.

Bashing the greats for their greatness is cool though. Bashing what’s universally acknowledged as brilliant is super punk rock because it’s *so* unexpected. Rage against the machine, and all that. #toocoolforquality
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Old 12.23.2017, 10:39 AM   #4853
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gonna re-re-re-re-re-watch RAN this weekend.

HURRAHH!!!
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Old 12.23.2017, 11:11 AM   #4854
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gonna re-re-re-re-re-watch RAN this weekend.

HURRAHH!!!

Such a good film. I think it's actually my favourite Kurosawa film.

Keeping on topic I'm about 1000 pages into War and Peace and I'm honestly loving it. Even the bits where he's waffling about why such-and-such a battle was lost start to grab me. It's annoying to be at a bit where Prince Andrei, or whoever, is having a dramatic scene and then the next chapter is an essay. However, just as you get into that chapter, he might go off to see what the Rostov family are getting up to.

I honestly love all the characters in it, ESPECIALLY Count Bolkonsky. They're all flawed characters (some more than others) but they all have even the smallest amount of redeeming factor. Except Pierre's wife. God, she's a fucking cunt.
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Old 12.23.2017, 11:15 AM   #4855
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Quote:
Originally Posted by demonrail666
I don't think people read Dickens now for his way with words, which is incredibly bloated at times, at least by today's standards, but for his creation of characters that seem to have near universal relevance, and for his social conscious. We can all play the game of dismissing a great writer on purely formal, medium specific grounds, but we dismiss a lot of great writers that way and end up celebrating a lot of mediocre ones in their place.

This pretty much sums it up. I dunno, I've grown up with Dickens all my life so I've a soft spot for him.

Thing is, people have anything else to do in terms of entertainment. So having a book that may be bloated by today's standards was nothing. You could easily spend hours reading with no other distractions around.
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Old 01.02.2018, 12:52 PM   #4856
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Got this for Xman, looks like it's going to be great. One of my favorite periods of literature. America from POB to around 1880

 


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Old 01.04.2018, 10:33 PM   #4857
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its been cold and frigid the past week and I've been reading more...

The Bomb Maker
- Thomas Perry. Well written thriller and I learned a lot about making bombs and deactivating them. Scary shit, really.

Two Kinds of Truth - Michael Connelly. the latest Harry Bosch novel, goes deep into the world of pill addicts and dealers, one of the best Bosch novels in awhile, and they're all good anyway.

Reilly:The First Man- Robin Bruce Lockhart. I've been fascinated by Sidney Reilly since I saw the miniseries on PBS back in the 80's. With the contemporary sophistication of intelligence agencies it is odd to read how highly he was regarded for what seems to be obvious, for instance, the best spies to recruit are going to be people of influence and power. You try to position people into those roles over time. While the series depicted Reilly's official death out in the woods by Stalin's goons, in this book,Bruce Lockhart's son shows tendencies and possibilities that Reilly never died and actually went to work for his home country, Russia. Much of Stalin's crew was not sophisticated and Stalin did need a few people of intelligence around to communicate with other people of intelligence.

The Looking Glass War - John Le Carre. 2018 will be my Le Carre year when I read the 20 novels of his I haven't read. Halfway through I can't really say what the book is about yet but I can't put it down.
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Old 01.05.2018, 03:45 PM   #4858
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Rob Instigator's TOP 5 BOOKS of 2017.




-In 2017 I managed to read and review 23 books for my blog RXTT's Intellectual Journey (https://rxttbooks.blogspot.com/)

Of those, here are my top 5.




Hail! Hail! Rock N Roll - Chuck Berry (autobiography) http://rxttbooks.blogspot.com/2017/0...uck-berry.html




Black Is The New White - Paul Mooney (memoir/autobiography/comedy)

http://rxttbooks.blogspot.com/2017/0...e-and-his.html




Tycho & Kepler - Kitty Ferguson (science history)

http://rxttbooks.blogspot.com/2017/1...o-shining.html




A World Apart - Gustav Herling (Memoir about Russian Labor Camps)

http://rxttbooks.blogspot.com/2017/0...ag-prison.html




The Stars My Destination - Alfred Bester (sci fi novel)

http://rxttbooks.blogspot.com/2017/0...-for-ages.html
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Old 01.06.2018, 11:03 PM   #4859
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i started pk dick's VALIS again after hearing a felicia atkinson song with quotes from it, but then i switched over to radio free albemuth, an abandoned precursor to VALIS.

VALIS is way better. one of my fav books.
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Old 01.06.2018, 11:23 PM   #4860
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Rob Instigator's TOP 5
The Stars My Destination - Alfred Bester (sci fi novel)

http://rxttbooks.blogspot.com/2017/0...-for-ages.html


G R E A T fucking book.
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