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Old 01.29.2013, 08:48 PM   #61
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Maryland Man Sues Firing Range for 'Reverse Sexism'




By ABBY ELLIN
Aug. 24, 2012



One Monday last October, Derrick Hunter decided to go shooting at the Maryland Small Arms Range in Upper Marlboro, his local firing range. He paid the $15 entry fee, and went inside.
And that's when the metaphorical bullets started to fly.
According to Hunter, 34, a special police officer, two women walked in behind him. Since it was "Ladies' Day," a longtime staple at the club, a manager told them they didn't have to pay.
Hunter heard the exchange, and asked if he could use the range for free too. "He said, 'It's Ladies' Day and you don't meet that criteria,'" he told ABC News. He accuses the firing range of "reverse sexism."
"Any time you get any kind of discrimination it does hit home to a certain extent," he said. "I have children. If don't stand for something you'll fall for anything. Sooner or later you have to stand up for your rights."
Hunter complained to the Human Relations Commission of Prince George's County, which reviews cases of discrimination. In August, it concluded that the case had merit. Last week, Hunter filed a $200,000 lawsuit against the firing range.
Carl Roy, president of the gun range, said he doesn't think he is doing anything illegal by letting in women for free.
"It's a governmental micro-managing society," he said. "If you read the county ordinance, they are narrowly construing discrimination to mean if you give a discount to somebody, then you got to give it to everyone. But no one is saying anything about age discrimination. They're not saying anything about occupational discrimination, or JC Penney giving free haircuts to children for the month of August."
Hunter's lawyer, Jimmy A. Bell, sees it differently. "If someone said because you were Jewish you'd have to pay more money, what would you think about that?" he said. "People don't look at it like that. People think a man should have to take it. And that's now how the law works."
As it happens, attorney Bell is no stranger to discrimination suits. In 2010 he sued a nail salon after he shelled out $4 more for a manicure/pedicure than women were charged.
He eventually settled with the salon for an undisclosed amount. But last year, he sued another nail salon, Nail First, on Hunter's behalf. Hunter didn't win any money, but the court issued a permanent injunction against the salon.
This time that would not be enough, said Bell.
"It's obvious that an injunction doesn't work," he said. "You've got to look at a person's dignity. When someone tells you that based on who you are, your physical characteristics, that you have less value to them than someone else, that stings a lot of people. It's illegal in our state. And it's been illegal since 1986."
"The special court of appeals outlawed gender discrimination and ladies' night activities in 1986," he said. "You can't offer one benefit to one group and not to the other group based on sex."
Brian Heller, a partner at Schwartz and Perry, an employment discrimination law firm in New York City, said the case is an interesting one. "On the one hand, the question is, are they treating men worse? Or are they treating women preferably?" said Heller. "And if they are treating women preferably, is there a legitimate business reason to do so?
"It's ultimately going to have to come down to a jury looking at the facts and making a decision as to what the intent was," he said. "The range could argue that there's a good reason to attract women members, and that they're not treating men badly but that they're encouraging women to sign up."
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Old 01.29.2013, 09:59 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knox
are you people seriously trying to imply that feminism is not humanism and equality?

Not at all, its just that your interpretation of feminism lacks humanism.
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Old 01.30.2013, 04:59 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nefeli
i agree with all that.
just to clarify, i m not pretending or avoiding anything.
i speak openly and say what i feel is needed to be said; i just do it without feeling that i have to characterize myself in any way.
i mean, i have met men who have said to me: i m a feminist.
so what?
from the way you will talk, i will understand many things about what you are.
or when people say, i m homosexual friendly.
if you think about it, its ridiculous to say smth like that.
i understand that we say terms, because it saves us time and dont get me wrong i used to call myself out to people a feminist for years, when i was little, i still might do if i have to, i just prefer to do things the way i do now.

I got all your posts completely and agree 100%. The fact that there is an issue with how genders relate to each other is no excuse to be a boring activist in areas of life that should exalt the human, rather than the gender. There are plenty of other venues where to fight for gender equality in a more effective way. Hence, for me, more Cosey Fanni Tutti and less Kathleen Hanna.
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Old 01.30.2013, 08:23 AM   #64
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I think it's pretty sick when someone says something like "reverse sexism" or "reverse racism", It's like implying that one kind of sexism/racism is the 'right' one, the other is 'reverse'. They'll be digging for whatever kind of exception they can find to justify this sick point.
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Old 01.30.2013, 08:27 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
Not at all, its just that your interpretation of feminism lacks humanism.

Oh yeah, my feminism is for non-humans.
Since I'm part of the women rights board of a large human rights organization, I'm going to take your complaint up to the directors, thanks.
We're going to store it in a big folder of emails we get from humanists that complain "there's too much being done about women and LGBTT, too much talk about racism" and not enough "about straight white men" who are terribly, terrible oppressed.
It's such an offensive thing we can't talk about human rights in general terms and they are specific issues to tackle - it offends the sensibility of cis-men who think they're being excluded. boo hoo.
Unless you're a pro-lifer. We don't take comments from pro-lifers.
They're not real people.
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Old 01.30.2013, 09:10 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
If you love studious and strikingly beautiful Human Beings from a nation not your own, the library is for you. Trust me.*

(*edited for semantic paranoia)

I'm in the library now. Haven't spotted any yet.
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Old 01.30.2013, 11:30 AM   #67
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Have you checked under you seat?
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Old 01.30.2013, 11:49 AM   #68
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wrong library!
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Old 01.30.2013, 03:19 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knox
Oh yeah, my feminism is for non-humans.
Since I'm part of the women rights board of a large human rights organization, I'm going to take your complaint up to the directors, thanks.
We're going to store it in a big folder of emails we get from humanists that complain "there's too much being done about women and LGBTT, too much talk about racism" and not enough "about straight white men" who are terribly, terrible oppressed.
It's such an offensive thing we can't talk about human rights in general terms and they are specific issues to tackle - it offends the sensibility of cis-men who think they're being excluded. boo hoo.
Unless you're a pro-lifer. We don't take comments from pro-lifers.
They're not real people.


Its nice to see that you feel that you and your affiliated "organizations" have the lock on defining who is and who isn't exactly human. Y'all must have a lot in common with other societal groups such as this or these..

The shame to me is you seem to think that "womens' issues" are exclusively the realm and domain of women. Humanism is to accept that humans come in two genders, but human issues are relevant for ALL humans regardless of gender.

Further, knox, you do realize that many women actually enjoy having men in their lives, you know, like in their families, at their jobs, in their circle of friends, and you might just need to sit down a moment before I tell you this, in their bedrooms
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Old 01.30.2013, 03:28 PM   #70
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Old 01.30.2013, 03:30 PM   #71
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The laddy doth protest too much.

ITT2: IN DEFENSE OF THE INDEFENSIBLE
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Old 01.31.2013, 10:47 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
Its nice to see that you feel that you and your affiliated "organizations" have the lock on defining who is and who isn't exactly human. Y'all must have a lot in common with other societal groups such as this or these..

The shame to me is you seem to think that "womens' issues" are exclusively the realm and domain of women. Humanism is to accept that humans come in two genders, but human issues are relevant for ALL humans regardless of gender.

Further, knox, you do realize that many women actually enjoy having men in their lives, you know, like in their families, at their jobs, in their circle of friends, and you might just need to sit down a moment before I tell you this, in their bedrooms

How old are you? This is a serious question.

I didn't think anyone over 12 and under 75 would be idiotic enough to vomit out the old cliche that "feminists are all lesbians who hate men". Do you not get embarrassed?

I really hope you're over 75.

And no, to be fair organizations don't say that. It's just me: pro-lifers aren't people, they're nasty monsters.
I actually hate to call them pro-life because they obviously hate life.

Have a nice day.
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Old 01.31.2013, 10:55 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

Further, knox, you do realize that many women actually enjoy having men in their lives, you know, like in their families, at their jobs, in their circle of friends, and you might just need to sit down a moment before I tell you this, in their bedrooms

I wanna sit down for a bit, someone has some repressed, conservative, hysterical comment to make with a hint of homophobia... Someone tries to cover up what we perceives as a insult with a . Someone has absorbed the discourse of conservative Republicans and won't admit to it.

Maybe I can make it look like I'm only saying it in jest and I'm a really good person if I add an icon... let's see...
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Old 01.31.2013, 10:56 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knox
I wanna sit down for a bit, someone has some repressed, conservative, hysterical comment to make with a hint of homophobia... Someone tries to cover up what we perceives as a insult with a . Someone has absorbed the discourse of conservative Republicans and won't admit to it.

Maybe I can make it look like I'm only saying it in jest and I'm a really good person if I add an icon... let's see...

knox, this was cute, I got a great laugh



Quote:
Originally Posted by knox
How old are you? This is a serious question.

I didn't think anyone over 12 and under 75 would be idiotic enough to vomit out the old cliche that "feminists are all lesbians who hate men". Do you not get embarrassed?

I really hope you're over 75.

And no, to be fair organizations don't say that. It's just me: pro-lifers aren't people, they're nasty monsters.

Have a nice day.
How old are you? If you can't embrace the reality that feminism is much more complex than your simplistic, short-sighted, vindictive interpretation then you my dear are the one who should get embarrassed. As for me? I am perfectly comfortable with my relationships with all the women in my life and my community, even if some folks ideologies, philosophies, or feelings are contrary to my own. I don't use dehumanizing terms to negate their realities, like you have. To say some humans "aren't people" and that they're "nasty monsters" is the kind of garbage that the assholes in Rwanda propagated. Good luck with all that hatred, you may just find over the course of your life that it will only consume you, it won't change the world for the better
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Old 01.31.2013, 10:59 AM   #75
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I never explained to you what feminism is and you never asked the first thing about my interpretation of it.
You just had to spit out the #1 conservative cliche about it in order to attack me.
Congratulations, at least you're quite open about your willingness to be ignorant.

Why are you getting all annoyed? I didn't know you consider to be yourself to be "pro-life". If that's the case, just come out already.

And then it'll be clear why feminism bothers you so much.

And to be clear: I love men. I just hate hypocritical bigots and idiots in general.
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Old 01.31.2013, 11:04 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knox
I never explained to you what feminism is and you never asked.
You just had to spit out the #1 conservative cliche about it.
Congratulations, at least you're quite open about your willingness to be ignorant.

Why are you getting all annoyed? I didn't know you consider to be yourself to be "pro-life". If that's the case, just come out already.

And then it'll be clear why feminism bothers you so much.

So do you project your fantasies on ALL people or just me? Feminism doesn't bother me in the slightest. Conservative? Bigot? That is funny, I am flattered truly. You're such a radical



 
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Old 01.31.2013, 11:04 AM   #77
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And just to be clear: a "pro-lifer" isn't someone who has a "different outlook" in life. It's someone who is intolerant, hates women and wants to control other people's lives, taking away their rights, imposing their beliefs. Simple.
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Old 01.31.2013, 11:05 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
So do you project your fantasies on ALL people or just me? Conservative? That is funny, I am flattered truly. You're such a radical


 

The more you try to hide it, the more the conservative cliches are coming out. It's an interesting show.
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Old 01.31.2013, 11:07 AM   #79
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Why don't we talk about how much I hate men and can't stand cock?
Can you explain to me, how did you find that out? Amazing.
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Old 01.31.2013, 11:08 AM   #80
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Originally Posted by knox
The more you try to hide it, the more the conservative cliches are coming out. It's an interesting show.



What ever supports your deranged fantasies to reinforce your delusional misinterpretations and exaggerations of feminism
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