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Old 11.28.2017, 02:34 PM   #161
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Originally Posted by evollove
Not sure what's gong on chemically, but tyrosine and caffeine blend has been a nice way to start my day. (Need to switch from coffee to green tea, tho)
oooh, tyrosine is a dopamine precursor and caffeine enhances dopamine signaling! so it’s a nice boost of “reward” chemicals most likely.

one thing i’ve read though is that low SEROTONIN makes one more dopamine-craving, so, prone to addictions in order to ‘“fill the void.”

ima read up on tyrosine supplements, which are reportedly cheep, but looking for “natural” means.

thanks!
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Old 11.28.2017, 02:53 PM   #162
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5) diet (oats/whey/garbanzo/etc) = increased tryptophan -> serotonin -> melatonin (sleep)

--Are some oats more tryptophan-ny than others?

--And are there foods that give a serotonin boost without the tryptophan step, or is that necessary?
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Old 11.28.2017, 03:21 PM   #163
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Originally Posted by evollove
--Are some oats more tryptophan-ny than others?

--And are there foods that give a serotonin boost without the tryptophan step, or is that necessary?
well more tryptophan does not necessarily mean more serotonin. that’s a fact shown by research i think.

but tryptophan as the precursor is necessary to make serotonin. so you need a basic level of it for sure, and beyond that i don’t know. but depends on your metabolism or how you synthesize things, why not eat more. it’s just food. that’s why i listed it last.

there’s also some relation with carb consumption and serotonin, i.e. carbs (the good ones) help keep your levels of serotonin up. so that 2 points for oats

for actual serotonin supplementation people use an intermediary form... 5-HTP or something it’s called? it’s a step between the 2 (closer to serotonin) but i’ve never tried it. i read it was banned and then allowed again. i really don’t know.

as for the oats, i think they’re all basically the same, except that the instant ones taste like shit and have a shitty texture. fuck that mess— grey boogers.

i buy the organic hippy rolled oats at the hippy story in bulk. they smell funkier than quaker oats. must be the patchouli! but yeah they cook in 5’ on the stovetop same as quaker and so cheap it’s affordable organic.

i’ve tried steel cut oats and they’re a pain in the ass if you ask me. i can’t wait infinite minutes for them to cook. oh, there’s this brand at costco, “coach” or something, that were tasty.

BUT LIGHT! this morning i sat in front of a window until my eyes hurt and it was a huge boost. free of charge. even a cloudy afternoon is brighter than what you get at an office. so... get outside some. the earlier the better so you get the most benefit. serotonin (peace) —> melatonin (sleep)
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Old 11.28.2017, 10:44 PM   #164
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ps read this! it’s good. useful, “free”, and even a little funny

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...tonin-activity
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Old 11.29.2017, 11:23 AM   #165
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(That massage bit depressed me. Reminded me I don't have anyone in my life to massage me on a regular basis. Thanks.)

Depression is my nemesis and he seems to flare up this time of year, but I've been doing well. It's the little things, boring things. Oats? I added that to my list.

Walking. Light. Water. Sleep. Meditation. Keeping busy. Nothing at all exciting, nothing that makes me wildly blissful.

But I think my goal used to be to defeat depression, when it makes more sense to just keep it under control by doing these little things on a mostly daily basis. Wish I knew this years ago. I was looking for a big answer, but it's just little maintenance things that have provided me with the most relief.

That's just my level of depression. Others may need more help.

Mornings are worse for me. Maybe my chemicals are out of whack the first few hours of the morning. Or maybe the problem comes from not being active and allowing my mind wander to bad places. Not sure.

All I know is depression used to rule my life and I finally got sick of it and have tried to fight back. It's been easier (but less exciting) than I would've thought.
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Old 11.29.2017, 05:58 PM   #166
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at least its not in all caps -
Can’t You See War On The Horizon?
Paul Craig Roberts
According to news reports in the British press, Russian President Vladimir Putin has instructed Russia’s industries to prepare themselves to be able to make a quick switch to war production. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/vladimir-putin-russia-business-war-production-sochi-military-talks-a8069951.html
Clearly, the Russian government would not make such an announcement unless it was convinced that the prospect of war with the West was real. For some time I have emphasized in my columns that the consequence of years of hostile actions taken by Washington and its European vassals against Russia was leading to war.
It is easy to understand that the massive US military/security complex needs a convincing enemy in order to justify its enormous budget, that the crazed neoconservatives put their fantasy ideology of US world hegemony above the life of the planet, and that Hillary and the Democratic National Committee will do anything to overturn Trump’s presidential victory. However, it is difficult to understand why the European political leaders are willing to put their countries at risk for Washington’s benefit.
Yet, they do. For example, on November 13 UK PM Theresa May said that Russia was a threat to international security and was interfering in European elections and hacking European governments. There is no more evidence for these claims than there is for “Russiagate.” Yet the allegations continue and multiply. Now the European Union is organizing former provinces of the Soviet Union—Belarus, Moldova, Ukraine, Georgia, Armenia, and Azerbaijan—into an “Eastern Partnership” with the European Union. https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2017/11/27/british-pm-makes-clear-eastern-partnership-created-damage-russia.html
In other words, the West is openly organizing former provinces of Moscow against Russia, declared by Prime Minister May to be a “hostile state.” Russia knows that there is no basis for the allegations against Russia and regards them as identical to the false allegations against Saddam Hussein, Gaddafi, and Assad in order to justify military attacks on Iraq, Libya, and Syria. Having convinced Russia that she is being set up for attack, Russia is preparing for war.
Think about this for a moment. The world is being driven to Armageddon simply because a greedy and corrupt US military/security complex needs an enemy to justify its huge budget, because Hillary and the DNC cannot accept a political defeat, and because the neoconservatives have an ideology of American Supremacy. What’s the difference between the detested White Supremacy and the American Supremacy that President Obama himself endorsed? Why is white supremacy terrible and American supremacy God’s gift to the “exceptional” and “indispensable” country?
The Russian government has openly shared its concern that Russia is being set up for military attack. As I, if not CNN, the New York Times, and the Washington Post, have reported, the deputy commander of the Russian military’s Operation Command stated publicly the concern that Washington is preparing a surprise nuclear attack against Russia. President Putin recently called attention to Washington’s collection of Russian DNA for a US Air Force weapons lab, which implies development of a Russian-specific bio-weapon. On many occasions Russia has called attention to US and NATO bases on its borders despite previous assurances from US administrations that no such thing would ever happen.
We have to ask ourselves why it is not the top item of public and political discussion that Washington has convinced Russia, a premier nuclear and military power, that Russia is going to be attacked. Instead, we hear of football players who kneel for the national anthem, fake news about Russiagate, a Las Vegas shooting, and so on.
We also must ask ourselves how much longer Washington is going to permit any of us via the Internet to report the real news instead of the fake news that Washington uses to control explanations. The effort by the Federal Communications Commission chairman to destroy net neutrality and other efforts underway to discredit factual news as Russian propaganda indicate that Washington has concluded that in order to war on Russia Washington must also war on truth. https://www.globalresearch.ca/the-fc...o-know/5619857 and https://www.globalresearch.ca/selected-articles-good-bye-to-net-neutrality/5620061
Washington will not survive its war, and neither will the American and European people.
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Old 11.30.2017, 04:24 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by evollove
(That massage bit depressed me. Reminded me I don't have anyone in my life to massage me on a regular basis. Thanks.)

maybe you can find a good and affordable massage therapist. no it doesn’t have to be with a happy finish in a truckstop but i guess it could too ha ha ha. but no, seriously, some places are quite affordable (i’m looking at you berkeley springs w. va.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by evollove
Depression is my nemesis and he seems to flare up this time of year, but I've been doing well. It's the little things, boring things. Oats? I added that to my list.

same here. it used to hit me by october, but i’ve been doing better since taking vitamin d supplements (by the way, take note)— it’s more delayed now but it comes as the winter deepens. and then there’s february and blam.

but today i sat outside with the computer for a while— it was bright and hard to see the screen but i can feel the effects. the first day i sat in front of the window i got so wired i had trouble sleeping that night. today i’m calmer— really calm like i’ve been dosed with lithium ha ha ha.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evollove
Walking. Light. Water. Sleep. Meditation. Keeping busy. Nothing at all exciting, nothing that makes me wildly blissful.

for the “wildly blissful” i think you gotta add to the dopamine side of the equation. that’s the pleasure neurotransmitter. obviously not with drugs that leave you spent later but an exercise high can be awesome. or doing something you do well like play music (doesn’t have to be with an audience).

Quote:
Originally Posted by evollove
But I think my goal used to be to defeat depression, when it makes more sense to just keep it under control by doing these little things on a mostly daily basis. Wish I knew this years ago. I was looking for a big answer, but it's just little maintenance things that have provided me with the most relief.

yep. discipline and consistency are key. i mean. you either make time your enemy or your ally.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evollove
That's just my level of depression. Others may need more help.

well of course

Quote:
Originally Posted by evollove
Mornings are worse for me. Maybe my chemicals are out of whack the first few hours of the morning. Or maybe the problem comes from not being active and allowing my mind wander to bad places. Not sure.

im not a morning person either, but sitting outside in the morning (no exercise required) is starting to work very quickly for me. the effect lasts for hours & hours. even a cloudy morning, yes.

as for wandering to bad places, yeah. the guy in that link talks about “remembering happy events” and that doesn’t have to come from a long time ago. it can be recent, like today.

e.g. i’m trying to practice what’s so cornily called “gratitude” ha ha ha, which is— to think about good shit that happens to you, however small. a bit like ivan denisovich in his gulag, yeah, thinking about his small victories. did you ever read that book? great great stuff.

to think about the good. that shit is key. it’s not lies really, it’s not denying bad shit happens. it’s just choosing to let the mind dwell in nourishment not poison and take some strength from it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evollove
All I know is depression used to rule my life and I finally got sick of it and have tried to fight back. It's been easier (but less exciting) than I would've thought.

yeah. don’t romanticize that bitch. depression is not your lover. you don’t need a grand dramatic exit to say goodbye to it. it’s one step, one step, one step, one step—like that. it’s really about maintaining your biolological state above instead of below a certain line. at least that’s how i’m trying to deal with it. it’s not about “happiness” so much as not having a broken brain/body.

light therapy, bitchez!
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Old 11.30.2017, 06:57 PM   #168
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I wake too early to grab sun right away. Have to wait an hour or so usually. But that's an appealing idea.

I've been taking a brisk walk through a long path that blends wooded area with open sun-filled patches. Plus for the past two days, some chick has been flirty as she passes, which is a nice boost for the ego, if anything. A nice stew of good stuff.

Yeah, February will be the real test.
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Old 12.01.2017, 10:08 AM   #169
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one more i tried a couple of times this week as the cold morning shower. cold! i yell and sing like a fucking foghorn but by the end of the shower im not cold anymore. it’s a huuuuuge dopamine boost. really wakes you up ha ha ha.
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Old 12.09.2017, 06:05 PM   #170
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Don’t read Psychology Today. Scientific American Mind is the only “pop” psych magazine that doesn’t embarrass the entire field of neuroscience.
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Old 12.09.2017, 06:08 PM   #171
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I’m depressed as fuck. And anxious. And kind of existentially flipping out. And angry. Usually when I’m depressed all I have to do is work like fucking crazy until I lose myself in the now, but lately my depression has been directly related to work.

So... klonipin, caffeine and prayer.
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Old 12.09.2017, 07:53 PM   #172
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I’m depressed as fuck. And anxious. And kind of existentially flipping out. And angry. Usually when I’m depressed all I have to do is work like fucking crazy until I lose myself in the now, but lately my depression has been directly related to work.

So... klonipin, caffeine and prayer.
welcome to winter!



you sure about the klonopin? i’ve never had a steady supply of them cuz the pushers said it makes you worse on the comedown and creates dependence

and caffeine boosts your dopamine but makes you anxious.
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Old 12.09.2017, 11:26 PM   #173
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welcome to winter!



you sure about the klonopin? i’ve never had a steady supply of them cuz the pushers said it makes you worse on the comedown and creates dependence

and caffeine boosts your dopamine but makes you anxious.

I’m... resigned to the klonipin. I’ve been on a pretty regular regimen of anti-anxiety medications since I was in college. I have yet to meet a doctor who didn’t think that I would probably need to have such a thing on-hand indefinitely, as I’ve had some really nasty anxiety and panic attacks at some really inopportune times in my life (driving, working, blah). I’ve been prescribed just about every kind, and klonipin in low doses seems to work best.
I definitely have a physical dependency, because that’s how this stuff works. But I don’t notice it because I never abuse so I never run out. If I had to go off the meds, I’d have to wean down, and I’m sure it would suck.

And yes, I do try other things. I don’t even drink caffeine much, and I meditate and know the drill. I have a serious anxiety issue. It makes me want to break things when I read about people selling these meds on the street, because for some people they are a really helpful tool.
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Old 12.10.2017, 07:55 AM   #174
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o man! that sounds rough. like a war vet.

not sure if this will be observable for you, given everything, but i notice tea for me has a calmer aspect to it than coffee. have you you tried/compared? ( this is of course peanuts vs. what you describe but small effects can add up i guess.)
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Old 12.10.2017, 10:44 AM   #175
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Originally Posted by !@#$%!
o man! that sounds rough. like a war vet.

not sure if this will be observable for you, given everything, but i notice tea for me has a calmer aspect to it than coffee. have you you tried/compared? ( this is of course peanuts vs. what you describe but small effects can add up i guess.)

Well, I used to drink coffe like a muh. Not just coffee ether... espresso and lots of it. (If you’re from the Pacific Northwest or the east coast, strong ass coffee becomes a way of life.) But yeah, I have tried tea exclusively a few different times. I like it, but unfortunately there’s something about green and back tea that kicks my gag reflex into overdrive. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had a few cups of tea and then puked a couple hours later. So I do really wussy teas, like that fake chai with milk that tastes more like cinnamon hot chocolate. That seems to be fine, and has just enough caffeine to do the job (too much sugar though... sugar increases anxiety too), but if I try to drink just black tea or green tea, I get ill. It’s fucking weird is what it is.

These days I only drink coffee on Wednesdays and Fridays, which are the busiest work days of the week, when I’m guaranteed to be at it from early morning until late at night.

Anxiety is a bitch. I don’t even know that what I’m going through now qualifies as depression, because it’s clearly rooted in fear about several different things going on in my life, or that seem like the might be impending. Nothing tangible though. Still not rational. Disabling at times. Hence the meds.

I think there is a little bit of PTSD to all of this as well, but that’s an anxiety disorder, so it’s all one thing in my mind. But it’s not really anything like what a vet goes through, I’m sure. I’m just a privileged middle class guy whose biggest enemy is his own brain.

But all things being equal, I’d rather have a pill available to me that can dramatically reduce the intensity of an attack when it hits. It reduces my anxiety just knowing it’s there. It’s not a great long term solution, but in this day and age, it’s reallt all about getting through the day. Survival baby!
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Old Yesterday, 11:33 AM   #176
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It's only recently I've thought about anxiety as a medical condition. I always thought of it as a state or mood, usually brought on by circumstances. "I am feeling anxious," "That makes me anxious," etc. And then the situation passes and so does the anxiety.

But persistent anxiety: I really don't know where it comes from or how to treat it. I don't think I have a lot, but I don't want any.

But me and depression are old enemies, and have you listened to symbols and I? Depression isn't impossible to control. It's just a bit boring and takes awhile to really see improvement. But it happens.

Do you exercise multiple times a week?
How's your diet?
Tried any meditation techniques AND kept up the practice?
Drinking enough water? (Really! That's no small thing.)

None of these help immediately, but even a week of being good to yourself starts to pay off.

And if you want to reply "I don't have time" I would say "Yes you do. Prioritize. Cut down on something to make room for self-improvement, then you'll have the mental/emotional resources you need to tackle your responsibilities with greater ease."

I know. It's a drag. You have to find the strength to even start, and then find even more to keep it up. But I can assure you that a bit of self-care on a regular basis really does help tremendously.

And it is about "controlling" depression. Not curing it forever.

But anxiety? I dunno. Hope someone can explain it's root causes and common treatments.
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Old Yesterday, 12:21 PM   #177
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well i think our discussion was more about mitigating the unavoidable than about completely curing something, right? i think mitigating, not controlling, is the accurate word.

i mean, there are mild mood disorders and there are serious medical conditions like a brain tumors. some shit you can handle with talk therapy, some require medication, some need brain surgery.

mitigation doesn’t guarantee a cure, but there’s always room for mitigation regardless, right?— just like even an incurable dying patient can benefit from hospice care.

so even the severely traumatized can benefit from some practices but it’s never gonna be 100%. still 10% better is better than none.

there’s this documentary about meditation i saw a couple of years ago. it was on netflix, i forget the name.

anyway they take these groups of war veterans who are all fucked up, addicted to shit, having problems coping, and they teach them meditation and other stuff. at the same time the researchers also teach meditation and breathing techniques to a bunch of traumatized fucked up little kindergarten kids.

at the end of the program, some people did better and some people relapsed or gave up on it. overall you could see it was positive— but you could see also it’s not a 100% cure. it’s a tough, long slog.

but yeah im having a cup of tea right now and i’m awake but also chill as fuck. for me it beats coffee. such calm.

sorry tea makes you vomit! weird.
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Old Yesterday, 12:37 PM   #178
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ps. check this out:

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/...ryId=102373662
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Old Yesterday, 01:18 PM   #179
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-I also need something in my belly for tea. First thing in AM is impossible. So YOU'RE weird.

-I prefer the word "control" because it makes me feel like I have control. Everyone else can call it whatever they want.

-Should I go through the research to find out what meditation doc was on Netflix? I mean, was it the best thing you've ever seen?

Severin, I don't know exactly what you're going through, but I've been super stressed everyday for at least a month, yet I'm keeping my shit together. And I'm a dumb damaged fuckup. So there's hope.
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Old Yesterday, 02:17 PM   #180
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-i fly my freak flag without shame. but you normaloids might want to try cream (or milk: rich in tryptophan).

-right

-it’s not the best thing ever but it dealt with real-life cases and in that it was eye-opening. ETA: FREE THE MIND was the name of it . see: http://danishdocumentary.com/site/freethemind/

extra: the npr show i posted above proved quite good. we all haven’t been tortured by the chinese or imprisoned in auschwitz but suffering is the universal constant of human life, so... we all have a measure of ptsd i guess.
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