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Old 04.04.2014, 03:57 PM   #37421
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
Some people are smokers and some are not. Just deal with it. If smoking does not give you pleasure any more, then don;t buy smokes. get rid of your smokes. stop hanging out with smokers. stop going to places where you would smoke. It is hard but so is learning how to eat pussy, and yet both are sooooo satisfying......
this is american hyper-individualism, and while it makes sense on the surface, it doesn't accurately reflect the way things are. life is difficult and reality is complicated. our choices and behavior are constantly being shaped by our environment. the individual doesn't exist in a vacuum. actually, the individual is defined by society. how can society define the individual and then disappear out of existence?
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Old 04.04.2014, 03:59 PM   #37422
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dead_battery
you're implying that i just need to want it more.

as if i dont want to never do it again or something? as if in the moment when i smoke, it's desire going "wrong". so i just need this magic x that will will make my desire be good.


There are no magic x's, if anything, cigarettes or other "habits" are futile attempts at finding that magic x. What is the futility? As the Buddha suggested, "Suffering is caused by attachment or desire." There is no magic cure for attachment, it is a matter of learning how to let it go gradually. Even God(s) isn't magical enough to negate attachment instantaneously, its part of our human nature. The meaning of life is again, learning this reality of ourselves and learning better how to manage and deal with it on a daily basis.
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Old 04.04.2014, 03:59 PM   #37423
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it fucking irritates me to be told to shut up and enjoy.

shut up and enjoy. everyday. everywhere. a fucking chorus of morons. over and over again. meanwhile the disaster goes on. mass suffering. but we should just shut up and enjoy.

its really fun to sneer at people who can't/don't/won't shut up and enjoy, cos they look like they are actually feeling something and that's not cool.

male posturing. idiotic fucking male posturing. a chorus of monkeys all screaming the same individualist script, like their rehash of individualist ideology is so fucking unique, like everyone hasnt heard it a million times already, like it actually works or signifies something other than redundancy.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:01 PM   #37424
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never said you should shut up. I like conversing with you.

I am saying that the energy you put forth railing against the system set up to fuck you, is better served in active decisions and choices that would benefit you.

I had to do it. I am not special. I was an addicted human who loves cigarettes more than you could ever imagine. but when the shit hits the fan, you either choose to change your habit, or you choose to stay in your habit. simple as pie.

the one thing that differentiates us from the animals is our ability to make our decisions based on conscious thought as opposed to sensory reflex. That is what is referrred to by the concept of free will. without free will human would never have mastered fire, would never have been able to create agriculture, or any of the many things which make our lives possible the way they are.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:02 PM   #37425
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the fire found us. the cigarettes smoke us. etc.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:02 PM   #37426
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Quote:
Originally Posted by !@#$%!
this is american hyper-individualism, and while it makes sense on the surface, it doesn't accurately reflect the way things are. life is difficult and reality is complicated. our choices and behavior are constantly being shaped by our environment. the individual doesn't exist in a vacuum. actually, the individual is defined by society. how can society define the individual and then disappear out of existence?

defining the individual is not what we are talking about. we are talking about the act of purchasing smokes, lighting one up, and inhaling it's smoke. you wanna stop? don't DO IT ANYMORE. If you cannot do that, then you need help doing it, and there is no shame in asking for help.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:03 PM   #37427
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you can all tell me OVER AND OVER AGAIN to deal with this as an individual and i can just stop listening or responding to this fucking redundant shit. as if i need to be told this.

do it yourself, make a choice. blah blah fucking blah.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:04 PM   #37428
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dead_battery
good choices to me are a fucking vain pretension.

maybe they work as a kind of retrospective description of the way you lived. you chose a route to death that involved maximum peaceful co existence. you helped others, you worked and kept civilization going. you made things or fixed things or something. a good life.

this is what i want. but talking about choices and free will is folk psychological superstition, or just plain showing off.

talking about free will and choice as if they exist independently from reality, that thing which determines what options there are for a person, is just ethically irresponsible.

No good choices are about simple math. If (a) than (b).. If (a) people ingest plants/substances which are biologically harmful to homeostasis, then (b) there will be biologically negative consequences. If (a) people make destructive decisions in their relationships with other humans then (b) those abused humans will react or retaliate in a negative way. If (a) we make decisions to hurt ourselves psychologically with negative or self-defeating thought processes or internal dialogue, then (b) we will gradually erode and destroy ourselves.

The meaning of life is to make good decisions. Not in some kind vain, self-seeking way, humans evolutionarily speaking or social creatures, we can't survive independent of other humans. If we make decisions that hurt other humans out of selfishness, we are actually hurting ourselves. Hence, making better decisions improves life.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:05 PM   #37429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
defining the individual is not what we are talking about. we are talking about the act of purchasing smokes, lighting one up, and inhaling it's smoke. you wanna stop? don't DO IT ANYMORE. If you cannot do that, then you need help doing it, and there is no shame in asking for help.

its not about me. its a collective problem and theres a collective solution. i am not fucking interested in being told AGAIN that i need to deal with it individually. how many fucking times do you guys want to tell me this, like it even means anything?
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:05 PM   #37430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
never said you should shut up. I like conversing with you.

I am saying that the energy you put forth railing against the system set up to fuck you, is better served in active decisions and choices that would benefit you.
.

no. part of it maybe, but not all.


he has enough energy to survive and then some.

he probably needs a little more energy towards survival but his social criticism is far from futile.

no fucking way.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:06 PM   #37431
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the meaning of male vanity is to make good decisions and brag and boast about them and lecture others on them.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:06 PM   #37432
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dead_battery
you can all tell me OVER AND OVER AGAIN to deal with this as an individual and i can just stop listening or responding to this fucking redundant shit. as if i need to be told this.

do it yourself, make a choice. blah blah fucking blah.

so why do you NOT DO IT then? Your answer to that is a personal thing, not applicable to anyone else.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:07 PM   #37433
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vanity does not discount a good decision
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:07 PM   #37434
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im not asking anyone for anything. and i also do not need to be talked to about my individual choices over and over again as if that makes them more real.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:07 PM   #37435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by !@#$%!
no. part of it maybe, but not all.


he has enough energy to survive and then some.

he probably needs a little more energy towards survival but his social criticism is far from futile.

no fucking way.

never said it was futile. just that it does not help his personal ciscumstances and personal cig addiction
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:07 PM   #37436
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
defining the individual is not what we are talking about. we are talking about the act of purchasing smokes, lighting one up, and inhaling it's smoke. you wanna stop? don't DO IT ANYMORE. If you cannot do that, then you need help doing it, and there is no shame in asking for help.
that's overly reductionist.

if life was that easy, we would have no addicts, everyone would be rich, and we'd always have nice weather.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:08 PM   #37437
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dead_battery
im not asking anyone for anything. and i also do not need to be talked to about my individual choices over and over again as if that makes them more real.

Your choices are only as real as you choose to see them
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:08 PM   #37438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by !@#$%!
that's overly reductionist.

if life was that easy, we would have no addicts, everyone would be rich, and we'd always have nice weather.

wrong, I was being specific to one individual, not the whole of society.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:08 PM   #37439
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
so why do you NOT DO IT then? Your answer to that is a personal thing, not applicable to anyone else.

because the sequence of words that (does not) constitute me is only an expression of a brain that is doing things on its own. the words come after the brains "decisions", which is just a description of its processes.
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Old 04.04.2014, 04:09 PM   #37440
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
never said it was futile. just that it does not help his personal ciscumstances and personal cig addiction

but you're enshrining the "personal" above all which is very culturally american and probably more so exacerbated in texas.

if you were in p.r. you'd probably be thinking more about the family. "smoking is bad for me but lets me work harder which is good for my family."
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