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Old 09.21.2010, 04:32 AM   #41
The Earl Of Slander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atsonicpark
Kaoru Abe is god.

He really, really is. Winter 1972, and all of the other solo stuff I've heard by him, is some of the most powerful and emotionally searing music that I've heard.
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Old 09.21.2010, 04:50 AM   #42
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Same here. WINTER 1972 is probably my favorite, along with JAZZ BED. I just can't believe this guy... he manages to make his saxophone squeal for 45 minutes straight, and it's somehow amongst the most powerful and interesting music I've ever heard. He never hits a wrong note!

Tons of albums for the uninitiated (get some Derek Bailey while you're there, specifically TOPOGRAPHY OF THE LUNGS):
http://experimentaletc.blogspot.com/...el/Kaoru%20Abe
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Old 09.21.2010, 05:36 AM   #43
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I would advise people who think free jazz is aimless horn honking made by self important charlatans (which it is at its worst!) to check out some of the groups who straddle the border between the free and straight worlds (by straight I mean music that retains elements of traditional jazz such as heads, songs, solos, occasional standards etc. rather than any sense of "seriousness"). The ICP Orchestra, Art Ensemble of Chicago, Vandermark 5, NRG Ensemble etc. are good places to start. If you can get into that then you might want to come back to the freely improvised stuff later (which I know isn't what this thread was intended to be about, but I think that is what a lot of people take free jazz to mean).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyRjG...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=perVF...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUy11...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cy2PtUh8Djo

Best (perhaps) concert I've ever been to:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeNtD...eature=related
That's my head obnoxiously swinging back and forth in front of Han's snare drum!
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Old 09.21.2010, 07:03 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ann ashtray
I looked at what Hendrix would do, and while I was never, and never will be able to play even remotely like that I came to the conclusion that he was perhaps one of the freest guitar players, ever. Of course he was taking full advantage of that pentatonic scale, but he was also going completely wild with it and making up his own weird chords and noodling with amp feedback/etc...which were anything but conventional at that time (matter of fact, most bands tried desperately to allow as little feedback as possible...now it's a staple in what a lot of bands do).

...

Hendrix was playing along with Albert King + Muddy Waters records before he ever stepped foot on a wah-wah pedal or played around with amp feedback. Thankfully, he embraced both....just look at what he did with all along the watchtower..even Dylan said Jimi's version was the definitive version of the song.

Exactly! 'Guitar people' who say that someone like Vai, or some other technically obsessed shredder, is the successor to Hendrix are totally missing the point. Hendrix wasn't a genius because he could shred really well, but because he would just fly off and follow his own 'free' ideas in the context of rock songs, and do it beautifully. Guitarists in the free jazz cannon, like say one of my all time favourites, Sonny Sharrock (or SY for that matter), capture a lot more of what I like about Hendrix than any 'shredder' ever will...
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Old 09.21.2010, 07:12 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Earl Of Slander
Exactly! 'Guitar people' who say that someone like Vai, or some other technically obsessed shredder, is the successor to Hendrix are totally missing the point. Hendrix wasn't a genius because he could shred really well, but because he would just fly off and follow his own 'free' ideas in the context of rock songs, and do it beautifully. Guitarists in the free jazz cannon, like say one of my all time favourites, Sonny Sharrock (or SY for that matter), capture a lot more of what I like about Hendrix than any 'shredder' ever will...

Ditto, ditto...

to quote a friend:

"jazz like hendrix".
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Old 09.21.2010, 07:16 AM   #46
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Just want to say that the greatest guitarist that I've ever heard is Lenny Breu, who is a jazz guitarist. I don't really listen to him very often (he's great, but not my favorite), but if anyone is curious about what it sounds like for a guy to have 20 fingers, check him out.
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Old 09.21.2010, 07:55 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hevusa
So post some stuff that is top shelf free jazz already!

I'm at work and don't have time to google for links, i'm sure you'll be able to find some yourself though

try these:

Alan Silva's Celestrial Communication Orchestra - Luna Surface
Sonny Sharrock - Black Woman (good place to start for rock fans maybe)
John Coltrane - Ascension, The Olatunji Concert, Interstellar Space
Archie Shepp - Blase
Pharoah Sanders - Karma, Black Unity
The Art Ensemble of Chicago - Les Stances A Sophie, People in Sorrow
Luther Thomas Human Arts Ensemble - Funky Donkey
Joe McPhee - Nation Time
Sun Ra - Atlantis, Space Is The Place
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Old 09.21.2010, 08:31 AM   #48
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today is the official free jazz day on syg.


 




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Old 09.21.2010, 11:01 AM   #49
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here is nels cline (gtr) playing with gregg bendian (dr) doing john coltrane's interstellar space. real real good top shelf free jazz.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxI_VBXIciw

for those that dont know nels he straddles the rock and jazz worlds. played with mike watt, thurston etc.. and now wilco of all bands!?! for the rock side and tons of heavy jazz folks as well.



when ornette first came to new york in 59 or 60 maybe one of his first big concerts was advertised as "Free Jazz" lots of folks came and then they found out they had to actually pay and then quickly left.
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Old 09.21.2010, 11:11 AM   #50
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Nels is a prime example of what I was talking about earlier...

Dude knows what the fuck he's doing, and therefor can take leaps into the unknown w/ plenty of tools under his belt to work with.

Getting noisy without a flashlight is like handing a guitar to a two year old...it might be "cute", but in most cases won't go much further than that.

Love Nels.
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Old 09.21.2010, 12:16 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glice
I really struggled to think of any songs. You won't appreciate this but it's one of the few instances of song within free jazz. I don't want to get all youtube comments about this, but if you don't appreciate forms outside of your own experience, why not shut the fuck up, eh? I don't think anyone in this thread is anything like 'elitist', and there's only really two people who've been in this thread who've got a particularly strong sense of music theory (and I'm sure those who aren't necessarily strong on it aren't that bothered).

Something I was going to ask of !"$% - I think part of the question might be Free Jazz's legacy - I think you could certainly make a case for, say, bits of DDN being heavily influenced by free jazz; from a more esoteric point of view, it's probably worth thinking about how people like Otomo Yoshihide, Nmperign or NNCK (3 names from a hat) incorporate elements from free jazz. There's a fine line between melodic extemporisation and free jazz though, so I find it a bit of an iffy one.

I wouldn't say this was 'purely' free jazz, for instance - but there are definitely elements of it later on in the piece.


Thanks for the examples. I enjoyed the Sun Ra song. The Patty Watters piece was a little harder to "dig" but definitely had experimental elements that were cool.
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Old 09.21.2010, 12:25 PM   #52
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I'm not so sure you're going to enjoy much of the stuff that's been posted unless you start getting rid of the ''it's experimental/avant'' mindset.
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Old 09.21.2010, 12:25 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themawt71
here is nels cline (gtr) playing with gregg bendian (dr) doing john coltrane's interstellar space. real real good top shelf free jazz.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxI_VBXIciw


Thanks for sharing. But I can honestly say that type of stuff does nothing for me. Not trying to be offensive... to each his own.
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Old 09.21.2010, 12:33 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hat and bread
I would advise people who think free jazz is aimless horn honking made by self important charlatans (which it is at its worst!) to check out some of the groups who straddle the border between the free and straight worlds (by straight I mean music that retains elements of traditional jazz such as heads, songs, solos, occasional standards etc. rather than any sense of "seriousness"). The ICP Orchestra, Art Ensemble of Chicago, Vandermark 5, NRG Ensemble etc. are good places to start. If you can get into that then you might want to come back to the freely improvised stuff later (which I know isn't what this thread was intended to be about, but I think that is what a lot of people take free jazz to mean).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyRjG...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=perVF...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUy11...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cy2PtUh8Djo

Best (perhaps) concert I've ever been to:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeNtD...eature=related
That's my head obnoxiously swinging back and forth in front of Han's snare drum!


hat and bread, those were all exquisite links! Loved em' all. I really like your taste. Guide me further if you have the time.
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Old 09.21.2010, 12:42 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toilet & Bowels
I'm at work and don't have time to google for links, i'm sure you'll be able to find some yourself though

try these:

Alan Silva's Celestrial Communication Orchestra - Luna Surface
Sonny Sharrock - Black Woman (good place to start for rock fans maybe)
John Coltrane - Ascension, The Olatunji Concert, Interstellar Space
Archie Shepp - Blase
Pharoah Sanders - Karma, Black Unity
The Art Ensemble of Chicago - Les Stances A Sophie, People in Sorrow
Luther Thomas Human Arts Ensemble - Funky Donkey
Joe McPhee - Nation Time
Sun Ra - Atlantis, Space Is The Place


Good stuff. Thanks for sharing.
I need to buy some records.
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Old 09.21.2010, 12:44 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hat and bread
Best (perhaps) concert I've ever been to:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeNtD...eature=related
That's my head obnoxiously swinging back and forth in front of Han's snare drum!

hey there! how's life?
this link is awesome, I will definitely search for more by Bennink
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Old 09.21.2010, 01:16 PM   #57
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Ornette Coleman in Germany 1978
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsT5J6TJIkk


Cecil taylor - Free Improvisation # 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EstPgi4eMe4

Albert Ayler - Ghosts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtiSA2RKDzc
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Old 09.21.2010, 03:03 PM   #58
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Don Cherry / James Blood Ulmer / Rashied Ali in Sweden 1978
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6S9eGFOcBEY

one of my favorite youtube clips
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Old 09.21.2010, 06:12 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toilet & Bowels
Sonny Sharrock - Black Woman
John Coltrane - Ascension
Pharoah Sanders - Karma

All the stuff you suggested is great, but those 3 are good candidates for THE 3 free records that I'd recommend to people first. Essential. Good picks.


Also:

[quote=Toilet & Bowels]Archie Shepp - Blase[/qoute]

Just got this from a friend on vinyl, and it's amazing. Especially the title track.
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Old 09.21.2010, 06:47 PM   #60
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really by far and away the best way to get into free jazz is to go and see it live, i don't know where you live hevusa but if you're really interested in getting your head around this stuff keep an eye out for when some good free jazz musicians are coming to your area.
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