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Old 02.03.2017, 07:13 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Severian
I think this is going to be a non hip-hop year, to be completely honest.

That Vince thing (which might actually just be a single?), another Danny Brown collabo with Paul White, and whatever the fucking fuck "More Life" is going to be, plus Yeezy Season 5 coming with no new music announcements, all point to this being an off-year for actual albums.

So far we have Run the Jewels and Migos. yaaaaaaaaay.

I think this is going to be an indie-rock bounceback year with lots of good electronic and experimental music to dig through.

So maybe we should talk about "old" hip-hip, just so this thread doesn't suffer. To this end, I've decided to read the 33⅓ entry on MBDTF — which should be here any day — for inspiration.
Wow, I didn't even know there was a 33⅓ entry on MBDTF. Looking forward for you to let us know if it's worth reading for sure.
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Old 02.03.2017, 07:15 AM   #122
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The new Big Sean album is just another Big Sean album. Meh. The Eminem verse he was trying to hype up in interviews is unsurprisingly unlistenable, as he's still on that annoying choppy ShadyXV flow. Rappity rap raps. This is gonna be a slow year for hip hop..
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Old 02.03.2017, 10:32 AM   #123
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feeling the same yeah.
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Old 02.03.2017, 11:18 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by louder
The new Big Sean album is just another Big Sean album. Meh. The Eminem verse he was trying to hype up in interviews is unsurprisingly unlistenable, as he's still on that annoying choppy ShadyXV flow. Rappity rap raps. This is gonna be a slow year for hip hop..

Oh man, that Big Sean is out already? Jesus, that didn't even register on my radar.

I feel bad for Big Sean. I like him as a person (least I think I do... he seems fairly sane and humble and likeable), but he is just NOT a great rapper. I actualy have started to skip through his verses in Kanye tracks. "See Me Now" is such a great song, but its momentum is halted by WAAAYYY too much Big Sean. His overlong verse is carried entirely by the beat.

Anyway, yeah, I think it will be a slow year. That's why I was looking through older café threads... thought maybe talking about the past would be more fruitful at the moment than talking about the present or future.
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Old 02.03.2017, 11:30 AM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by louder
Wow, I didn't even know there was a 33⅓ entry on MBDTF. Looking forward for you to let us know if it's worth reading for sure.

Yop, came out just a couple years after MBDTF, I think, making it something of an anomaly in the 33⅓ canon if I understand things correctly. It was written by Kirk Walker Graves, who is pretty green and doesn't seem to have much professional writing to his credit other than a handful of contributions to Noisey and Pitchfork, and nothing of note since the book came out in 2014.

Part of me wonders how in the hell he landed the deal, with virtually no résumé. But he's a fan, and he is determined.
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Old 02.03.2017, 11:42 AM   #126
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Oh, and he also went to Princeton, which he really wants you to know... Otherwise, why would he answer such a straight-forward question in such a grandiose manner:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirk Walker Graves

333sound Interviewer: What, in particular, drew you to writing about this album?

KWG: Kanye West was the most reliably divisive pop figure of the past decade. Drawing public rebukes from no less than two U.S. Presidents, he managed to self-destruct in such spectacularly visible fashion that he became a kind of protean reflection of the nation’s collective disgust. Whatever one’s particular social grievance – celebrity entitlement, race-baiting, the end of etiquette, etc. – Kanye’s damage was capacious and accommodating enough for all. He was an interesting foil to Barack Obama in that sense, as Obama became – over the course of the 2008 campaign – an infinitely malleable ideal in the public imagination. Candidate Obama managed to embody hope, change, healing, redemption, and transcendence, all before breakfast. The fact that Kanye’s unforgivable sin occurred at the expense of America’s most commodified ingénue was sublimely fitting. Taylor Swift puts a lot of care into maintaining her immaculately curated aura. The market for her music grows – it seems – in geometric proportion to her brand integrity, which is manifest in everything from the saccharine sincerity of her lyrics to her enterprising notions of good-girl-slighted romance. What better villain for her, then, than an openly reckless narcissist with zero self-control? As a pop moment, the whole thing had a kind of banal Shakespearean grandeur in its aptness.

Lost within this vortex of mortified indignation, though, was a simple truth, which is that Kanye West created the most consistently ambitious and thrilling pop music of the last decade. He may never eclipse his longtime idol Michael Jackson, but he has earned his place on pop’s Olympus. In a span of less than seven years, he released five uniquely masterful (if uneven) albums, sonic collages whose singular production, neurotic bombast, and grandiose contradictions form a complexly personal narrative arc. By my lights, My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy is the culminating epitome of this progression, the narcissistic crown jewel. As a feverishly perverse fairy tale – a fantasy – the album imparts no digestible moral takeaway. It’s a journey into the rococo heart of Ye’s diseased ego, a walk down gilded passageways with two-way mirrors for floors. Mythological monsters, well-heeled demons, and misunderstood porn stars beckon at every turn. His sampling on the album is jaw-droppingly inspired. The omnivorous scope of his sensibility is astounding – researching the samples in his music is an education in how improbable sonic worlds are always all around us, gestating in unlikely places. Whether quoting King Crimson for emphasis (“POWER”), or capturing a fleeting outburst from an obscure Rick James performance to haunt a beat (“Runaway”), Kanye’s best songs are a subgenre unto themselves, weaving other people’s hooks and melodies and drum breaks into something wholly, profoundly original. He’s a genius of novelty-through-synthesis, the Steve Jobs of contemporary hip-hop.

HAAAAAHAHAHAHAAAA!!! Ok friend, we get it, you've got words.

It's an interesting and wholly readable statement, if you're a fan of Kanye West who wants to read about how awesome Kanye West is. But as an answer to such a simple question, it's pretty frustrating. It's also canned as hell. I'd rather hear a genuine (re: live) answer to the question than a ponderous meta-analysis of modern culture. Save the pontificating for the book, G!

....

Anyway, I read the introduction (book hasn't arrived yet, blast it!) and it was interesting.

I'm pretty sure I'm not going to be a fan of the guy's style though.
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Old 02.03.2017, 11:49 AM   #127
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if an album is "uneven" then it is NOT "masterful"

what horrible verbal diarrhea posted above.... I hate that shit.
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Old 02.03.2017, 12:12 PM   #128
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Never mind about Big Sean...

Big Sean raps about murdering Donald Trump in new freestyle... Praises Kanye and Jay-Z

Lol.
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Old 02.03.2017, 12:18 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
if an album is "uneven" then it is NOT "masterful"

Not sure that's a rule. Actually I'm fairly certain it's not. There's no mutual exclusivity between "masterfulness" and "evenness." Imagine Abbey Road, for example. It is "uneven" structurally and in terms of quality, as the first half contains a crap song and the second half is just one long-ass song that's awesome. It is masterful, however, by all accounts.

Your logic would dictate that any album that is not entirely consistent (e.g., songs in first half are better than also-good songs in second half) cannot be masterful, and I would take issue with that.

Quote:
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what horrible verbal diarrhea posted above.... I hate that shit.

Yeah, I kind of agree. Like I said, fun reading for a Kanye freak, but is it actually goo music writing? Ehhh... I know it's not great journalism.
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Old 02.03.2017, 02:10 PM   #130
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masterful applied to an album of songs infers no dud songs to me. I personally see Abbey Road as perfect in all ways.....hahhahahaha
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Old 02.03.2017, 02:18 PM   #131
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I can't help but pick up some of those 33 1/3 books because they're about albums I love... I've yet to read one that I thought was really good though.
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Old 02.03.2017, 07:32 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noisereductions
I can't help but pick up some of those 33 1/3 books because they're about albums I love... I've yet to read one that I thought was really good though.

Maybe I will write one.

Seriously, if all they require of their authors is some (apparently minimal) experience, a college degree, very little talent, and a near-clinically-obsessive lov of music then... shit, I'm simply THE guy.

Honestly I think MBDTF is a bad choice for a book like this. It's too obvious, for one thing... the best music journalism explores the most interesting qualities of music and recording in an environmental and cultural context. I LOVE MBDTF, but that album isn't great because of its relevance to anything outside of the musical realm, nor is it great in spite of the odds being stacked against it. It's great because it is Kanye West drilling deep into, and doubling down on, everything about him that was over-the-top and decadent. It's great as a singular document... it represents Kanye turning all elements of Kanye up to 11, and making music that was big and audacious enough to go with the ego. And because despite how awful all of that sounds in theory, the music itself is just so goddamn good.

It almost feels like a cop-out that, in 2014, there was a book about one single Kanye album, and that album was MBDTF, the one that set the bar impossibly high and kind of put Ye's future in jeopardy for a bit.

I think the story behind Late Registration would be MUCH more interesting. When MBDTF came out, it was basically just the biggest musician in the world throwing a huge party and making the biggest album of that year. Not really much of a story there.

I think the story behind Late Registration is much more intersting. Rocafella hit-boy overcomes sophomore slump by ditching virtually every aspect of modern hip-hop, hiring a George Martin figure (Jon Brion), and making an album based on the the Beatles' chamber-pop experimentation on Rubbrr Soul. Now THAT album was an against-all-odds success, and there's something marvelous about the production and recording decisions made by West and Brion throughout the record.

808s & Heartbreak would also be an excellent story, for obvious reasons.

Writing about MBDTF is awesome, but who the fuck would choose to write about Thriller over the world-beating, epoch-making Off the Wall? Who would choose to start writing about the Beatles with Sgt. Pepper? I don't know... seems like a missed opportunity. MBDTF is my favorite Kanye album, but I think I'd rather read about pretty much any of the others.
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Old 02.04.2017, 12:28 AM   #133
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Graduation or 808s for me.
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Old 02.04.2017, 07:52 AM   #134
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Old 02.04.2017, 04:10 PM   #135
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Oh shit guys, Sampha's new album.. fucking INCREDIBLE.
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Old 02.07.2017, 11:35 AM   #136
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Got my 33⅓ book on MBDTF.

Guys, it's so small!

As I told evollove yesterday in a pm, the writing is ... kind like snarky music writing a la pitchfork mixed with fan fiction. Not excellent. Also, the author has an intersting (interestingly stupid) take on "George Bush doesn't care about black people" that I find borderline insulting, given the circumstances surrounding that event, and the (I'm sorry) unpleasant truth to what Kanye said. The author chooses to zoom in on Kanye's shaky voice and inability to articulate, ultimately calling the whole thing a missed opportunity to say something profound.

I believe this is not only inaccurate, but insensitive. Kanye is pretty obviously "on the spectrum" of Autistim, and he's been public about his mental and behavioral health issues. Mr. Princeton author is showing his stripes as a bit of an ignoramus, and also a shitty Kane West fan by displaying such poor judgment and lack of insight on this issue. One can't support Kanye's stupid beefs with Taylor Swift and condemn his ballsiest political statement, and expect to be taken seriously as someone who understands Kanye's music and what it means in a cultural and political context.

Kanye's lack of eloquence in speaking is not the result of a stupid mind. It's the result of a slightly unhinged one, one that doesn't always know how to handle social situations and interactions. But even if that wasn't the case... WHO THE FUCK CAN BLAME A GUY FOR HAVING A SHAKY VOICE WHEN HE'S CALLING OUT HE ORESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES IN FRONT OF THE ENTIRE WORLD?

So far, I'm enjoying this little thing more because I like reading about Kanye than because it's any good. Why the hell was he even talking about "GBDCABP" in fucking 2014? In a book about MBDTF? Katrina was already nearly a decade old when this book was published. Stay on track, Princeton!

Aaaaanyway, again, fun reading for a guy who enjoys reading about Kanye. Mostly well (or well-enough) structure sentences, even if the attempt to over-intellectualize is blatant and a failure.

Will comment more as I go.
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Old 02.07.2017, 02:09 PM   #137
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Are there any stories that are not well known about the recording process in the book? Everyone knows it was in Hawaii etc etc I just didn't know if it was one of the 33 1-3s where it's just the writer being a cunt the whole time or if it was an actually informative one like the VU&Nico one
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Old 02.07.2017, 06:55 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by TheDom
Are there any stories that are not well known about the recording process in the book? Everyone knows it was in Hawaii etc etc I just didn't know if it was one of the 33 1-3s where it's just the writer being a cunt the whole time or if it was an actually informative one like the VU&Nico one

I think it depends on the 33⅓ book. Or, rather, the author. This guy seems to be have a pretty broad focus, discussing culture and politics and the digital age, and using a lot of metaphors to make global, grandstanding statements.

I really did just get the book, and Neil Gaiman's "Norse Mythologies" came out today, so between that and working my attention has been divided. I haven't enountered ANY stories about recording yet actually. Shit about Matt Lauer, George Bush, Twitter/Facebook, etc. I'll let you know though.
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Old 02.10.2017, 01:33 PM   #139
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There's a new Lupe Fiasco album out. I didn't know until 5 minutes ago, or I forgot. It's not Drogas. It's "Drogas Light." Drogas will come out soon or something.

These are not great days for hippity hop. Not great indeed.
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Old 02.10.2017, 02:39 PM   #140
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hippy hoppy is dead. Just like Rock n roll, Jazz, and whatever the fuck Mumford Fleet & Foxes Sons is supposed to be.
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