Originally Posted by atsonicpark

Please explain to me how it is depressing? It makes people happy to watch and jack off to. It makes tons of people tons of money to do NOTHING except fuck for 20 minutes per scene. Seriously -- do you know how rich porn stars/directors/companies are? Also.. porn actors/actresses are consenting adults who are making tons of money showing us their bodies which we beat our meat to -- it's just a fun, silly thing. Shocker of the year, no one forces porn stars to do any of the stuff they do -- they WANT to, whether for money, self-exploration, for fun, whatever. It's really not that shocking nor that big of a deal in any way. I can think of things in life a lot more depressing than consenting adults rolling around in bed for 20 minutes and getting paid thousands of dollars to do it. If you find it depressing, don't watch it. Obvious. I just don't see how it's such a big part of anyone's life on here that they would say it's "depressing".

As for Asian porn, what another poster said.. they have a completely different lifestyle and society than we do. They can't show cocks but they can show chicks sticking shit up their vagina. Whatever. They're just more extreme than we are, and it's not really our place to judge that.

But yeah, bukakke is great. That's the main porn stuff I watch. For lots of good porn, check out puretna.com or empornium... good streaming porn can be found at www.tnaflix.com if you don't want the shit on your mommy's computer.

I thought that money was a forceful reason enough to enter the porn industry in the first place?

Also, what ''Asian'' society do you speak of? Thai? Japanese? Chinese? Mongolian? Tibetan? Are all these societies the same and one?

Regarding the porn industry in general, it is not all like it seems on the surface. In the UK gay porn industry (where else?), the practice of barebacking is contributing a great deal to a hell of a lot of new HIV infections every year, mainly because the film companies that produce these movies often don't care enough to check and follow up the HIV status of many of the aspiring actors.

It is true that a number of these actors enter the industry mainly because they don't want to get a regular job and that, but what about the human trafficking that takes place with young girls being bought and sold for prostitution and forced to also perform in the amateur porn film industry that is ever so popular? Can you see the fun and glamour in that?

I think that glossy American/European porn is one thing and crude, gritty pornography forged from human squalor are two very distinct things.

[atsonicpark]

Yeah, exactly, Cant. And you know what happens when chicks get fed up with porn? They, uh, QUIT! So, what's depressing about a chick doing what she wants, making a shit-ton of money, and then quitting when she doesn't want to do it anymore? Nothing.

"No pornography exploits women. It exploits men. It’s the men that are made to look stupid, silly and ridiculous, chasing after the golden elixir. Women look beautiful, do what they wanna do and get paid for it." - Lydia Lunch

Pork: I was referring to Japanese bukakke and such. And yeah, so there is no confusion: This thread (I think) is for the discussion of glossy porn, not snuff films or rape films or anything like that. Of course that shit's depressing -- it's real!

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

Yeah, exactly, Cant. And you know what happens when chicks get fed up with porn? They, uh, QUIT! So, what's depressing about a chick doing what she wants, making a shit-ton of money, and then quitting when she doesn't want to do it anymore? Nothing.

"No pornography exploits women. It exploits men. It’s the men that are made to look stupid, silly and ridiculous, chasing after the golden elixir. Women look beautiful, do what they wanna do and get paid for it." - Lydia Lunch

1 - What does the first part of your post mean in a rational and realistic context?


2 - Lydia Lunch may be a great performer and all that, but she is hardly someone whose philosophy I take all that seriously.

[atsonicpark]

1 - It was stating the obvious: no one is forced to do this, no one has to remain a porn star if they don't want to stay one, etc.

2 - I don't know how much I agree with her or like her but this thread reminded me of that quote, so I posted it.

[m1rr0r dash]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

2 - Lydia Lunch may be a great performer and all that, but she is hardly someone whose philosophy I take all that seriously.

fair enough.

camile paglia:

“The prostitute is not, as feminists claim, the victim of men but rather their conqueror, an outlaw who controls the sexual channel between nature and culture.”

“Pornography is human imagination in tense theatrical action; its violations are a protest against the violations of our freedom by nature.”

“My thinking tends to be libertarian. That is, I oppose intrusions of the state into the private realm -- as in abortion, sodomy, prostitution, pornography, drug use, or suicide, all of which I would strongly defend as matters of free choice in a representative democracy.”



as Andrea Dworkin points out - "The female manifests in her adult form--cunt. She emerges defined by the hole between her legs.... she is an object, with no control over her own mobility, capable of no assertion of personality. Her body is a body, in the same way that a pencil is a pencil, a bucket is a bucket, or, as Gertrude Stein pointedly said, a rose is a rose."

Sorry, but angry American feminists with skewed views about themselves and others are not taken seriously by the person who is writing either. With no offence, I rarely take any American intellectuals seriosuly at all.

[Johnny "Magic Fingers"]

justine joli... the only porn star i know of who has the hots for 18th century french literature (...misfortunes of virtue, anybody?) and 16th century italian political commentary (she has a link on her home page labelled "panic" that takes you to a text of the prince.)

...and she's got totally normal sized tits. hawt.

Yeah, aka 'Swan'

 

She is atttactive. That lollipop is obviously a reference to the French
Commedia dell'arte theatre style of the 17th century.

Anyway, porn falls in the similar vein as drugs or gambling. It's all good unless you become obsessed (read: addicted) with it.

But I don't get into the degradation that comes with porn. People will draw their own line as to where sexy stops and degradation begins. I like girls - I don't wanna see them get gang-banged, shat on or er ... having to engage with marine life.

Whatever happened to good ol' wholesome cartoon porn where nobody gets hurt?

 

[Cantankerous]

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

"No pornography exploits women. It exploits men. It’s the men that are made to look stupid, silly and ridiculous, chasing after the golden elixir. Women look beautiful, do what they wanna do and get paid for it." - Lydia Lunch

yeah basically i was paraphrasing that quote because i think it's true (NOT because lydia lunch said it because she has said a lot of things that i disagree with completely)
not because i'm an angry american feminist, because i'm about the opposite.

[m1rr0r dash]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

Sorry, but angry American feminists with skewed views about themselves and others are not taken seriously by the person who is writing either. With no offence, I rarely take any American intellectuals seriosuly at all.

fair enough... not a big fan of paglia myself, honestly.


have some french theory: "[Simone de] Beauvoir goes on to analyse the average French male need to reduce her to a sexual object as a knee-jerk reaction to feeling that their superiority was being questioned. She also suspected that they were deeply threatened by her claim that many French women did not lead blissful sex lives."

Originally Posted by m1rr0r dash

fair enough... not a big fan of paglia myself, honestly.


have some french theory: "[Simone de] Beauvoir goes on to analyse the average French male need to reduce her to a sexual object as a knee-jerk reaction to feeling that their superiority was being questioned. She also suspected that they were deeply threatened by her claim that many French women did not lead blissful sex lives."

Do you Know what? I was just reading an article on the Guardian yesterday that mentioned Simone de Beauvoir. It was about French women compared to their British counterparts and was written by Zoe Williams, who can come up with the goods better than others, at least when she is making a point about being a woman or talking about women.

[m1rr0r dash]

or maybe a fellow brit is more yr speed:

... a classic analysis by Laura Mulvey of what is called the male gaze: "In a world ordered by sexual imbalance, pleasure in looking has been split between active/male and passive/female. The determining (human) male gaze projects its phantasy onto the (human) female figure which is styled accordingly. In their traditional exhibitionist role, women are simultaneously looked at and displayed, with their appearance coded for strong visual and erotic impact so that they can be said to connote "to-be-looked-at-ness." Pornography, like much of culture, enacts this "to-be-looked-at-ness." Indeed, because pornography is so much a part of our patriarchal culture, it is hard to perceive its specific harm, that is, to stand outside of it sufficiently to perceive the value hierarchy of man over woman and mind and soul over body that it enacts, the somatophobia that it expresses. This difficulty in perceiving harm explains the attraction of a "naked" campaign, because it will get media attention since the media is a primary source of encouraging women's "to-be-looked-at-ness."

The Laura Mulvey quote doesn't seem all pro-pornography to me. Oh, and I'm Italian, not British.

[m1rr0r dash]

you've got porn in yr parliament.

 

 

Had that in parliament, which is always populated by even worse creatures than her. Still, pornstars of a European/ American extraction we are talking about, not exactly a realistic picture at that.

[m1rr0r dash]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

Do you not what? I was just reading an article on the Guardian yesterday that mentioned Simone de Beauvoir. It was about French women compared to their British counterparts and was written by Zoe Williams, who can come up with the goods better than others, at least when she is making a point about being a woman or talking about women.

you mean the woman who wrote this?

By axing adult channels in such a liberal age, Travelodge doesn't look unprejudiced but dated


interesting woman, i'll have to read more...

[m1rr0r dash]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

I thought that money was a forceful reason enough to enter the porn industry in the first place?

very astute comment, but the force/coercion you write of speaks more to the monolithic force of the invisible hand weighing down on all of us equally, than any sort of male coercion directed toward women.

Originally Posted by m1rr0r dash

very astute comment, but the force/coercion you write of speaks more to the monolithic force of the invisible hand weighing down on all of us equally, than any sort of male coercion directed toward women.

Oh, I was being an angry commie with that one.

Zoe Williams:
She is capable of giving a brilliant account of certain aspects of the female mind, but in saying that she is also capable of writing some seriously stupid stuff, sometimes vaguely tinted by mild xenophobia.

On the subject of hypocrisy married with pornography, I always wonder about those free gay mags that you see piled up in every gay bar. The layout is generally like this:

Editorial - Where what's written is meant to illuminate your average fag about the homophobia and stereotyping that we are surrounded by.

The entertainment section - Where the most trites of things that are meant to make you look and feel like a better fag are advertised. This includes a selection of sometimes ok music coupled with a parade of atrocities.

The sex/health advice section - Where a generally well meaning doctor tells you what is the cause of your genital warts/ shyphilis, or why your otherwise faithful boyfiend is bonking your best mate.

Right in the middle of this stands the porn section. In the past this section had to place little censoring stars where the male member was shown. Now you can have graphic sex in your hands for free and every week.


Near the end you get the pics of fags having fun, generally looking like cattle ready to be shipped to Gran Canaria for more sex, cries of ''Fab!'' and general stereotypes to be spread even more.


These publications are as widespread as STI's and are meant to be a tool of education and emancipation for the gay community. Why, I have never understood.

[gmku]

Originally Posted by Toilet & Bowels

does anybody else find that as they get older they find pornography more & more depressing?

i mean, what happened to these young ladies to make them want to behave like that?

 

I wouldn't know. Ask some old guy.

[m1rr0r dash]

ansley park neighborhood in atlanta - the castro, san fran of the southeast - had those also... not just in the gay bars, but outside the hair salon (learn how to be fabulous while gatting yr hair done) and in little metal boxes at the street corner like for a real newspaper (the personal ads - find yr next one night stand while you wait to cross the street). they also had an only slightly more serious newspaper called The Southern Voice - that they ripped the name from the The Village Voice should be an embarrassment to gay people everywhere... compare headlines:

Village Voice:

In (Partial) Defense of Eliot Spitzer
Pucker Up by Tristan Taormino

Lower East Side Fujianese Joints Becoming More Refined
Counter Culture by Robert Sietsema

and sure - the occasional shlock piece like...
I Don't Like Easy Pussy.
What Is Wrong With Me?
by Dan Savage


Southern Voice:

Local: Public health struggles to reach gay ‘hidden population’
Experts say CDC must look for gay men outside of bars, bathhouses
breaking news: gays outside the bathhouse? stop the presses!!


Local: Gay couples face tax time dilema
Experts offer strategies for getting the biggest refund
more money? how fabulous!!

and important national news stories like:
National: McGreevey aide says he had sexual trysts with N.J. ex-governor, wife
wtf? blech... who reads this crap?

[gmku]

Originally Posted by m1rr0r dash

you've got porn in yr parliament.

 

 

Wow, she sort of looks like Garcia on Criminal Minds. Garcia is hot. And she got shot. But not a lot.