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Old Yesterday, 07:29 AM   #281
Severian
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Originally Posted by guest
does that make it any more excusable to repeatedly say faggot or refer to asians as bottom feeders? because if so then by that logic itís fine for a white person to use the n word.

people need to stop holding rap to a lower moral standard than other music, itís reductive and condescending

No, but I think context is somewhat important, especially when discussing art.

Honestly Iím not excusing it, but I also donít think that Lee Daniels Freestyle, which comes with a literal note saying, ďI wrote this because Iím pissed about cultural stereotyping, and I want to show you how it feels when that happens,Ē is evidence of blanket homophobia.

Again, I do think thatís a shallow read.


Maybe people should stop pretending that rap is Un-Art and that complex messaging isnít possible in the genre.

Ever seen, like, Kids? Or more recently mid90s? Disparaging, homophobic language abounds, but nobodyís accusing Jonah Hill of homophobia. And his movie didnít even come with an explanation.

Anyway, whatever.


New JPEGMafia album is crazy, and honestly barely qualifies as rap music.
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Old Yesterday, 06:12 PM   #282
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I love and despise Dr Dre's The Chronic. It's great music... The bass line to "the night the ____ took over" is pure genius. But god damn that misogyny. It's repulsive.
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Old Yesterday, 09:47 PM   #283
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it is definitely a selective read on my part but I can’t get over the fact that making a track like that is espousing some degree of hatred, irrespective of intent. and especially when the audience for this stuff like it or not isn’t exclusively able to exercise that critical distance (considering this is very much in the lineage of ‘masc angst’ music).

no one is saying that rap isn’t art here, quite the contrary. I think art is held to certain moral standards and yeah it may be transgressive but I don’t think that excuses using a lexicon that is obscenely hurtful to certain groups. comparing it to film is something else entirely because those are character studies; jpegmafia is coming at it from a singular cis male perspective and regardless of his unarguable lack of privilege in other facets of his life for him to co-opt the difficulties of others is just a bit much.

it’s ovviously separate from Dre and his domestic violence anthems or kanye west just being a general misogynistic pig, but if we’re going to apply a critical lens to all music then rap should be subjected to the same scrutiny.
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Old Today, 07:47 AM   #284
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Originally Posted by guest
it is definitely a selective read on my part but I can’t get over the fact that making a track like that is espousing some degree of hatred, irrespective of intent. and especially when the audience for this stuff like it or not isn’t exclusively able to exercise that critical distance (considering this is very much in the lineage of ‘masc angst’ music).

no one is saying that rap isn’t art here, quite the contrary. I think art is held to certain moral standards and yeah it may be transgressive but I don’t think that excuses using a lexicon that is obscenely hurtful to certain groups. comparing it to film is something else entirely because those are character studies; jpegmafia is coming at it from a singular cis male perspective and regardless of his unarguable lack of privilege in other facets of his life for him to co-opt the difficulties of others is just a bit much.

it’s ovviously separate from Dre and his domestic violence anthems or kanye west just being a general misogynistic pig, but if we’re going to apply a critical lens to all music then rap should be subjected to the same scrutiny.

OK, that’s fair.

I honestly am turned off by the — what’s it called? “Incel”? — vibe and general tendency to troll like Pepe the fucking Frog in JPEG’s music. How great would it be if the endless culture-trolling and edgelord bullshit was just toned down a wee bit and the focus could be entirely on the music.
I have similar issues with Tyler the Creator and Kanye. Trolls, all of them. To their detriment.

But I guess I look past it if the music is engaging, and “Peggy” makes some pretty engaging music, so..

But yes, rap should be subject to the same scrutiny. And to be honest, looking at those lyrics again made me feel a little bleh.
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Old Today, 07:51 AM   #285
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Originally Posted by d.sound
I love and despise Dr Dre's The Chronic. It's great music... The bass line to "the night the ____ took over" is pure genius. But god damn that misogyny. It's repulsive.

I cannot listen to Dre.

I canít listen to Eminem. Donít care if heís reformed. Iím a little shocked at my high-school self for listening to him at all, and letting shit slide.

Dr. Dreís not just a misogynist either. Busted up his exís face until it needed to be fitted back into place. Fucking disgusting.
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Old Today, 05:51 PM   #286
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to be honest when I first heard jpegmafia I did think there was something interesting going on musically but you’re right, there’s something about that troll aesthetic that seems really popular at the moment that’s super off-putting. and for some reason I can’t look past that a good 90% of the time now, and I wouldn’t even attribute it solely to hip hop, the vast majority of noise repulses me at this point for being so far up its own arse too and falling into that trap of being perhaps performatively vitriolic? but as is well established here I’m a cynical cunt so grain of salt obviously
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Old Today, 06:53 PM   #287
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Originally Posted by guest
to be honest when I first heard jpegmafia I did think there was something interesting going on musically but youíre right, thereís something about that troll aesthetic that seems really popular at the moment thatís super off-putting. and for some reason I canít look past that a good 90% of the time now, and I wouldnít even attribute it solely to hip hop, the vast majority of noise repulses me at this point for being so far up its own arse too and falling into that trap of being perhaps performatively vitriolic? but as is well established here Iím a cynical cunt so grain of salt obviously


A great deal of today's culture is either performatively woke or performatively vitriolic. It's quite hard to escape
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