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Old Today, 01:00 PM   #6281
!@#$%!
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Originally Posted by demonrail666
No, but mine was. You asked what I meant by ruthless which I assumed you meant in reference to my point about ruthless corporate practices, so I gave a real world example of one.
that is a deadbeat customer not a “corporate practice”

deadbeat customers come in many forms, from internet pirates to people who default on their credit cards and the banks has to “settle”. the orange blob was also a consummate deadbeat. sometimes when a good honest business begins to fail they can’t meet their obligations either. shit happens to everyone.

there is a risk when you lend money to anyone. filling a purchase order is an act of lending. it takes trust. this is where credit ratings come handy—you know who is a credit risk.

a customer with good credit usually will have a running account with a business, even get discounts.

a deadbeat might be required to pay upfront in cash.

a business in the habit of stiffing their suppliers is going to run out of suppliers very fast

these things are part and parcel of doing business. this is why there is loss as well as gain. this is what the average uninformed indoctrinated does not understand—they think that “business” is all gain all the time.

the question of getting paid sooner but less, or later but in full, is the reason why lending risk needs to be factored in. sometimes everyone pays on time and you have “excess profits! shame on greed!”. and other times you’ll be robbed.

this is also why there is a trade in business notes. if you’ve ever considered a “money market” account in the bank, it comes from the trade of, among other thing, business debts as financial instruments.

so... i get that your employer was stiffed by a corporate customer but that is not a feature of “corporate practices”.
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Old Today, 01:23 PM   #6282
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Two reasons the Bookies are probably correct:

TRUMP gains with Blacks, Hispanics and Women

CANDIDATES Embrace Reparations For Slavery

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Old Today, 02:18 PM   #6283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by demonrail666
I don't know if it'll ever be accepted in the US but I can see the Universal Basic Income idea becoming an inevitability in Europe before very long. Personally I think governments need to stop being squeamish about this and look to introducing some version of it at least as soon as possible.
here in the US we have Earned Income Credit.

when you make below a certain treshhold, you get PAID taxes instead of paying them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earn...ome_tax_credit

i think it’s a good anti-misery tool. it’s never gonna buy you all the pleasures in life but it prevents some of the worse scenarios.

the ubi idea might work. read the news the other day the finland results were that it does not encourage more work, but it’s not so bad either. would have to look into again but it remains an interesting proposition.

i’m more interested however in UNIVERSAL BASIC CAPITAL. which rather than pay an income would give everybody a stake in the stock market.

i don’t know how that would work or if people would be easily dispossessed of it the same way indians were swindled out of their land allotments in oklahoma.

but in a post-labor era when we’ll start to be replaced by automation and artificial intelligence, it might be a way forward
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Old Today, 03:18 PM   #6284
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Originally Posted by !@#$%!
it does not encourage more work,

That's the point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by !@#$%!
i’m more interested however in UNIVERSAL BASIC CAPITAL. which rather than pay an income would give everybody a stake in the stock market.

Yeah, possibly the worst idea I've heard since ... I dunno ... ever?
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Old Today, 03:26 PM   #6285
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Originally Posted by demonrail666
That's the point.
no that wasn’t. there were several things being tested:

i’ll be a deadbeat customer and copypaste you this short article:

https://www.economist.com/finance-an...ork-incentives

Finland’s basic-income trial did not much affect work incentives

Among the adherents of universal basic income (ubi) are the Italian government, India’s opposition party and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, a Democratic congresswoman in America. Boosters argue that a minimum income would be a safety-net for people in precarious jobs—eg, those at risk of being displaced by automation. Others see a way of eliminating complex, even corrupt, social-security bureaucracies.

Naysayers, horrified by the potential cost of ubi, fret that state handouts will put recipients off work. Early results from Finland’s basic-income experiment, released on February 8th, suggest that such fears are overdone, but don’t resolve much else.

Researchers randomly chose 2,000 people on the dole to receive for two years a monthly payment of €560 ($634) instead, whether or not they sought or started work. After a year, recipients were no less likely to be working than those on the dole. On average, both groups worked nearly 50 days a year and earned around €4,250.

Some ubi supporters may be disappointed that the scheme did not increase time worked. Unlike other benefits, which are withdrawn as claimants find work and so tend to discourage them from accepting a job offer, the basic income creates no such disincentive, because it is paid even after claimants take up work. But most proponents do not see employment as ubi’s primary goal. They will be cheered by the fact that the participants reported being happier.

There are limits to the lessons from the experiment. The results only assess its first year. Even the trial’s full two-year duration—a time period settled on because of a lack of resources, and ministerial impatience—may not be enough to observe changes to behaviour, says Minna Ylikännö, a researcher on the project. The scheme was also restricted to the unemployed. Other pilots, such as that funded by y Combinator, a startup accelerator, in America, will also shed light on how low earners might respond if they are paid a basic income. Evidence so far is scant. But that has not stopped Italy, which begins its “citizens’ income” scheme—a variant paying €780 a month to those living below the poverty line—in the spring. True believers need no proof
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Old Today, 03:30 PM   #6286
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Originally Posted by demonrail666
Yeah, possibly the worst idea I've heard since ... I dunno ... ever?
seriously? what’s the basis of your judgment?

here’s some stuff to think about

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asse...egalitarianism

https://www.thehindu.com/opinion/lea...le26122852.ece

i have no position on the matter at this point but it’s worth considering since the purported problem of inequality is not one of income but of wealth
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Old Today, 03:51 PM   #6287
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Old Today, 03:52 PM   #6288
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Old Today, 03:58 PM   #6289
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UBI can be sold any way, on any principle but the only reason governments are starting to consider it is because they face a social disaster as up-coming generations face a future with less and less real job opportunities. It'll be ushered in gradually using different rationales but the ultimate aim is to effectively normalise unemployment.
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Old Today, 04:16 PM   #6290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by demonrail666
UBI can be sold any way, on any principle but the only reason governments are starting to consider it is because they face a social disaster as up-coming generations face a future with less and less real job opportunities. It'll be ushered in gradually using different rationales but the ultimate aim is to effectively normalise unemployment.
the purpose of production is consumption

if we can produce without employment—why not?

we’d get to retire at birth....

we’re all naturally rent seekers. as long as we don’t cheat or steal or manipulate others for it... i’ll take it
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