[atsonicpark]

haha.

[scott v]

yeah, i was bored the other day...

Originally Posted by jetengine

The Velvet Underground, second album

Which one is this meant to be? That I know of, the third album was meant to sound much harder but their pedals and some other gear got stolen at the airport before recording, but I am not aware of a second album by the Velvet Underground that was meant to be but wasn't. There are songs that went on to appear on VU and Another View, sure, but those weren't songs for a second album.

[dazedcola]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

Which one is this meant to be? That I know of, the third album was meant to sound much harder but their pedals and some other gear got stolen at the airport before recording.

Hmm Ive never heard about that before, please tell more, links?

[screamingskull]

If 'From a Basement on the Hill' had been released the way it had been intended to it would have been far far far far far far far far far far far far far far better. They missed out about 12 songs on the release of that album that should have been on there, some songs were also not finished, so if they had been finished it would have been great.

Originally Posted by dazedcola

Hmm Ive never heard about that before, please tell more, links?

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. The third album was meant to have a heavier sound but it didn't because some of the gearhad vanished. This according to Sterling Morrison on some interview that I read a few years ago.

[jetengine]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

Which one is this meant to be? That I know of, the third album was meant to sound much harder but their pedals and some other gear got stolen at the airport before recording, but I am not aware of a second album by the Velvet Underground that was meant to be but wasn't. There are songs that went on to appear on VU and Another View, sure, but those weren't songs for a second album.

The one (partially) recorded in (I think) early '67, and which can be found in really low-fi (mono?) tracks on the '95 box set:

'It's Alright (The Way that You Live)'
'There is No Reason'
'The Sheltered Life'
'Here She Comes Now'
'I'm Not Too Sorry (Now that You're Gone)'
(I think 'Guess I'm Falling in Love' was to be included as well on this record.)

It's too bad they never completed this project. I have a feeling it could have turned out to be their best--absence of Nico notwithstanding. They re-recorded 'Here She Comes Now' and used it on White Light/White Heat--presumably in place of 'Guess I'm Falling in Love', which had been recorded in December of '67 and eventually wound up on Another View minus the vocals.

As for VU, that consists of roughly 80% material for the unreleased fourth album. Apparently, there is an unreleased later version of 'Stephanie Says' (minus John Cale), and an earlier version of 'Sad Song' (a Loaded-era version appears on the box set and Fully Loaded), for those two tracks were intended to round out the fourth album, along with 'Foggy Notion', 'My Best Friend', 'Andy's Chest', 'Ocean', 'I'm Sticking With You' and the unreleased 'Lonesome Cowboys' (named after the Warhol film; possibly an early version of 'Lonesome Cowboy Bill'). Another View, on the other hand, is pretty much a career-spanning odds 'n' sods collection--bits and pieces, leftovers, alternative versions, etc.. I love the second version of 'Hey Mr. Rain' off that one, by the way--great track.

[HaydenAsche]

Originally Posted by screamingskull

If 'From a Basement on the Hill' had been released the way it had been intended to it would have been far far far far far far far far far far far far far far better. They missed out about 12 songs on the release of that album that should have been on there, some songs were also not finished, so if they had been finished it would have been great.

Truth.

Originally Posted by jetengine

The one (partially) recorded in (I think) early '67, and which can be found in really low-fi (mono?) tracks on the '95 box set:

'It's Alright (The Way that You Live)'
'There is No Reason'
'The Sheltered Life'
'Here She Comes Now'
'I'm Not Too Sorry (Now that You're Gone)'
(I think 'Guess I'm Falling in Love' was to be included as well on this record.)

It's too bad they never completed this project. I have a feeling it could have turned out to be their best--absence of Nico notwithstanding. They re-recorded 'Here She Comes Now' and used it on White Light/White Heat--presumably in place of 'Guess I'm Falling in Love', which had been recorded in December of '67 and eventually wound up on Another View minus the vocals.

As for VU, that consists of roughly 80% material for the unreleased fourth album. Apparently, there is an unreleased later version of 'Stephanie Says' (minus John Cale), and an earlier version of 'Sad Song' (a Loaded-era version appears on the box set and Fully Loaded), for those two tracks were intended to round out the fourth album, along with 'Foggy Notion', 'My Best Friend', 'Andy's Chest', 'Ocean', 'I'm Sticking With You' and the unreleased 'Lonesome Cowboys' (named after the Warhol film; possibly an early version of 'Lonesome Cowboy Bill'). Another View, on the other hand, is pretty much a career-spanning odds 'n' sods collection--bits and pieces, leftovers, alternative versions, etc.. I love the second version of 'Hey Mr. Rain' off that one, by the way--great track.

I'm still confused by your post because I think that you might be talking about the lost fourth album from when they got dumped by MGM. VU and Another View contain the majority of the tracks from that album, but also some Cale-era unreleased tracks, but I'll double-check with the lovely people from The Velvets forum. You might mean that the songs listed are mostly demos that were meant for the second record but didn't make it, am I right?

[jetengine]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

I'm still confused by your post because I think that you might be talking about the lost fourth album from when they got dumped by MGM. VU and Another View contain the majority of the tracks from that album, but also some Cale-era unreleased tracks, but I'll double-check with the lovely people from The Velvets forum. You might mean that the songs listed are mostly demos that were meant for the second record but didn't make it, am I right?

No, no, no. They begun a record that would have taken its place between the official first and second albums. The five tracks I listed above comprised the initial demo, collected on the box set. Apparently, the project was abandoned for unclear reasons.

The fourth album is contained on VU, with the exceptions of 'Sad Song' (earlier version than the one recorded for Loaded, by some accounts), 'Stephanie Says' (later version recorded after Cale left), and 'Lonesome Cowboys' (unreleased). This is according to Maureen Tucker, by the way, as quoted in Up-tight: The Velvet Underground Story by Victor Bockris and Gerard Malanga (essential book for Velvet fans!--rarely has there been a rock bio that contains so much vital info in so few pages).

In terms of source tapes, Another View is all over the place.

Originally Posted by jetengine

No, no, no. They begun a record that would have taken its place between the official first and second albums. The five tracks I listed above comprised the initial demo, collected on the box set. Apparently, the project was abandoned for unclear reasons.

The fourth album is contained on VU, with the exceptions of 'Sad Song' (earlier version than the one recorded for Loaded, by some accounts), 'Stephanie Says' (later version recorded after Cale left), and 'Lonesome Cowboys' (unreleased). This is according to Maureen Tucker, by the way, as quoted in Up-tight: The Velvet Underground Story by Victor Bockris and Gerard Malanga (essential book for Velvet fans!--rarely has there been a rock bio that contains so much vital info in so few pages).

In terms of source tapes, Another View is all over the place.

I'll double-check on Uptight again, because I still don't remember anything about a second album that was abandoned as such, not certainly in terms of it being a major project. Another View is more of the same but with less material to fill a whole record, and it does contain songs from the shelved fourth album. Still, at the time it came out, I was overjoyed with being able to get more unreleased VU material, so that's a good thing, after all.

[jetengine]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

I'll double-check on Uptight again, because I still don't remember anything about a second album that was abandoned as such, not certainly in terms of it being a major project. Another View is more of the same but with less material to fill a whole record, and it does contain songs from the shelved fourth album. Still, at the time it came out, I was overjoyed with being able to get more unreleased VU material, so that's a good thing, after all.

There's nothing in Up-tight about the proposed second album--that's touched on in the box set book and other sources. The track listing for the fourth album is outlined courtesy of Mo in Up-tight; however, nothing on Another View was intended for that. 'Real Good Time Together' and 'Coney Island Steeplechase' may date from roughly the same sessions, but they were not intended for the fourth album. The fourth album was to consist of the tracks I've listed in my previous posts on this thread--if we can take Tucker's word for it, circa 1982.

[jetengine]

Okay, from what I can piece together from various sources and recording dates, here's how it breaks down...

The sessions for the unreleased fourth album were recorded in May and June of 1969. The finished album was to feature the following tracks (I'm unsure of the running order):

Foggy Notion
My Best Friend
I'm Sticking With You
Andy's Chest
Ocean
Stephanie Says (later version, as opposed to the Feb/'68 version with John Cale included on VU)
Sad Song (most likely an earlier take, as opposed to the one dating from the Loaded sessions recorded for Atlantic/Cotillion)
Lonesome Cowboys (unreleased; an early version of 'Lonesome Cowboy Bill'...?)

Left over from these sessions were the following tracks that (apparently) did not make the final cut:

I Can't Stand It*
Ferryboat Bill**
Coney Island Steeplechase**
Rock And Roll**

*collected on VU
**collected on Another View

Apparently, while they were waiting for Verve/MGM to release the fourth album, they started work on what would have been (presumably) Album No. 5. The sessions for this projected LP were recorded in September and October of 1969; they include:

One of These Days*
Lisa Says*
Real Good Time Together**
I'm Gonna Move Right In**
Ride Into The Sun**
(and possibly 'Countess From Hong Kong', collected on the box set, but I'm truly speculating here)

*collected on VU
**collected on Another View

Anyway, that's the best I can do in piecing it all together. It's still a damn site easier than piecing together The Doors' and The Who's lost tracks and intended projects....

[Insignificant]

Originally Posted by jetengine

The one (partially) recorded in (I think) early '67, and which can be found in really low-fi (mono?) tracks on the '95 box set:

'It's Alright (The Way that You Live)'
'There is No Reason'
'The Sheltered Life'
'Here She Comes Now'
'I'm Not Too Sorry (Now that You're Gone)'
(I think 'Guess I'm Falling in Love' was to be included as well on this record.)

It's too bad they never completed this project. I have a feeling it could have turned out to be their best--absence of Nico notwithstanding. They re-recorded 'Here She Comes Now' and used it on White Light/White Heat--presumably in place of 'Guess I'm Falling in Love', which had been recorded in December of '67 and eventually wound up on Another View minus the vocals.

As for VU, that consists of roughly 80% material for the unreleased fourth album. Apparently, there is an unreleased later version of 'Stephanie Says' (minus John Cale), and an earlier version of 'Sad Song' (a Loaded-era version appears on the box set and Fully Loaded), for those two tracks were intended to round out the fourth album, along with 'Foggy Notion', 'My Best Friend', 'Andy's Chest', 'Ocean', 'I'm Sticking With You' and the unreleased 'Lonesome Cowboys' (named after the Warhol film; possibly an early version of 'Lonesome Cowboy Bill'). Another View, on the other hand, is pretty much a career-spanning odds 'n' sods collection--bits and pieces, leftovers, alternative versions, etc.. I love the second version of 'Hey Mr. Rain' off that one, by the way--great track.

I think "Move Right In", "Ride Into the Sun", "Guess I'm Falling in Love", "Stephanie Says", and "Hey Mr. Rain" were slated to be on a third album before Cale was forced out.

"Men of Good Fortune" dates back as early as '66, while "Say Goodnight", later "Goodnight, Ladies", was first performed around 1969. Think about what else might be found on some of Cale's tapes, or Klimek's, or Warhol's. Not just things later released, but unreleased.

[jetengine]

Originally Posted by Insignificant

I think "Move Right In", "Ride Into the Sun", "Guess I'm Falling in Love", "Stephanie Says", and "Hey Mr. Rain" were slated to be on a third album before Cale was forced out.

"Men of Good Fortune" dates back as early as '66, while "Say Goodnight", later "Goodnight, Ladies", was first performed around 1969. Think about what else might be found on some of Cale's tapes, or Klimek's, or Warhol's. Not just things later released, but unreleased.

Of the officially released studio 'leftovers' (and I'm not too familiar with the bootlegs), I think it's safe to say that 'Hey Mr. Rain', 'Temptation Inside Your Heart' and 'Stephanie Says' were recorded with the intentions of including them on a third Cale-based album. 'Guess I'm falling In Love' had been floating around in some form or another since the winter of '66/'67; the instrumental version that finally came out on Another View dates from the White Light/White Heat sessions in December of '67. It's unclear if they intended to include a completed version of that on the alleged record. However, 'The Story of My Life' and 'What Goes On' had definitely been worked up while Cale was still around--he gets credit as co-songwriter on the former, and there's a Cale-inclusive live version of the latter on the box set. As for 'Ride Into the Sun' and 'Move Right In', those weren't recorded until the fall of '69 long after Cale left--unless, of course, there are earlier versions sitting somewhere in a can....

Originally Posted by jetengine

There's nothing in Up-tight about the proposed second album--that's touched on in the box set book and other sources. The track listing for the fourth album is outlined courtesy of Mo in Up-tight; however, nothing on Another View was intended for that. 'Real Good Time Together' and 'Coney Island Steeplechase' may date from roughly the same sessions, but they were not intended for the fourth album. The fourth album was to consist of the tracks I've listed in my previous posts on this thread--if we can take Tucker's word for it, circa 1982.

I'm sorry? So, where does this mysterious unreleased second album comes from. You're getting more and more confusing with these third and fourth albums. I haven't had the time to check neither Uptight nor the box set, but I will and give you some feedback.

Originally Posted by jetengine

Of the officially released studio 'leftovers' (and I'm not too familiar with the bootlegs), I think it's safe to say that 'Hey Mr. Rain', 'Temptation Inside Your Heart' and 'Stephanie Says' were recorded with the intentions of including them on a third Cale-based album.

Well, exactly. But what I have asked you originally was where did you hear about this unreleased second album, and I'm still waiting for a clear answer.