Does Religion Kill More Than It Saves the Man ?

dazedcola · 07.10.2006, 07:17 PM

Lee brought up a good question in "karen revisted", what do you think about that phrase ?

I agree with it. Look at all the people that have died and wars that have been fought over religious beliefs. Organized religion is a dangerous thing in my mind. I understand that some people need something to believe in, but with religion comes power which can lead to violence. I think the world would be better without religion and people just living by a set of morals.

!@#$%! · 07.10.2006, 07:20 PM

religion killed daycare nation's brain. now look at him...

schizophrenicroom · 07.10.2006, 07:21 PM

if all the bullshit that went on in god's name stopped, this world would be nice.

!@#$%! · 07.10.2006, 07:21 PM

i must slobber over somebody else before i slobber over schizo again

SpectralJulianIsNotDead · 07.10.2006, 08:00 PM

Are we graduating from troll-whore-bicker-fest into political-religious-bicker fest?

If so, I guess the devolution has reversed.

I don't think the statement is really something I can agree or disagree with. It is sort of vague.

I think Lee is trying to say something about her attitude. She is very jaded and negative. When I listen to the song, I always think about those girls that have to tell you they are athiest and how much they hate religion everytime God comes up in conversation. Then they recite the rhetoric they have read in their books that they read to seem intelligent. Like the issue of belief versus athiesm is not dependent on just themselves, but on the whole world.

Does that make sense?

acousticrock87 · 07.10.2006, 08:18 PM

Mankind kills more than it saves man.

Organized religion is an extremely broad concept, as there are many that have truly stood for peace and done so successfully, many that stood for peace but failed to bring it about, and many that stood for peace and achieved the opposite. Religions that actually set out to kill man are few and far between; unless you're witty and satirical - then of course anything can be made to seem so. Religion itself is not the problem, it's people involved in it. And those people don't need religion to do it. It's just a simple catalyst. Especially if you believe religion is myth - then it's obviously something that mankind is naturally drawn to.

But how can anyone believe something because it makes them feel better? That's not believing, that's deluding. If I tell myself that I'm going to survive this plane crash to make myself feel better about it, that isn't actually believing that I'm going to survive - that's keeping my mind off of reality. I still know I'm probably going to die. I don't believe in religion because it makes me feel good - it doesn't. I believe in it because it makes sense.

golden child · 07.10.2006, 08:22 PM

opinions kill men.

nomadicfollower · 07.10.2006, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by acousticrock87

Mankind kills more than it saves man.

Organized religion is an extremely broad concept, as there are many that have truly stood for peace and done so successfully, many that stood for peace but failed to bring it about, and many that stood for peace and achieved the opposite. Religions that actually set out to kill man are few and far between; unless you're witty and satirical - then of course anything can be made to seem so. Religion itself is not the problem, it's people involved in it. And those people don't need religion to do it. It's just a simple catalyst. Especially if you believe religion is myth - then it's obviously something that mankind is naturally drawn to.

But how can anyone believe something because it makes them feel better? That's not believing, that's deluding. If I tell myself that I'm going to survive this plane crash to make myself feel better about it, that isn't actually believing that I'm going to survive - that's keeping my mind off of reality. I still know I'm probably going to die. I don't believe in religion because it makes me feel good - it doesn't. I believe in it because it makes sense.

Well put.

Daycare Nation · 07.10.2006, 08:39 PM

It kills the part of the man that deserves to die.

nomadicfollower · 07.10.2006, 08:40 PM

What kind of man deserves to die?

Daycare Nation · 07.10.2006, 08:41 PM

I didn't say that...I said it kills that "part" of the man which deserves to die.

nomadicfollower · 07.10.2006, 08:43 PM

Which part of man deserves to die?

Daycare Nation · 07.10.2006, 08:44 PM

It kills the lower self, which to most people may look like it kills more than it saves. But to the one who is saved, they are in fact dead to their old selves....

It doesn't happen all at once, it a process of growing closer to God, widening one's awareness, and allowing the false sense of "separation and divisiveness" to disappear...

Which means someday I won't stoop to the level of people who attack me on message boards....but in the meantime I am imperfect.

nomadicfollower · 07.10.2006, 08:52 PM

Shedding your old, imperfect self, for a new perfect self, seems like using religion as a way to 'feel good'.
What's an imperfection, though?
According to the bible, man became imperfect when Adam and Eve ate the apple, right?
Man became imperfect when it consulted it's conscience.

Daycare Nation · 07.10.2006, 08:59 PM

Confronting one's own faults is not "feeling good." It is realizing that one is not living up to the commandment to "love your neighbor as yourself." If by "feeling good" you mean being righteous, then I agree. Righteousness means having the right relationship to God, the world and one's self. I don't believe in original sin. I believe in karma.

terminal pharmacy · 07.10.2006, 09:13 PM

there are beautiful people in all religions, there are also evil violent people in all religions, it is not the religions it is the people. as to the world being better without religion and people just living by a set of morals (who makes the morals then, do you?) ... forget about it, this is never going to happen so forget about any utopian dreams of planet earth. we live in dystopia, we always have and always will, humans will never know peace. we must live in reality and not use certain practices as scapegoats for all of the worlds ills because it is ignorant. this is not a personal attack dazedcola just rational thought.

m^a(t)h · 07.10.2006, 09:23 PM

my friend walked in the woods yesterday and burned all his religious stuff in his room: a bible, a framed photo of jesus, a rosemary. It must have been a beautiful fire...

Daycare Nation · 07.10.2006, 09:43 PM

You mean a Rosary.

Cantankerous · 07.10.2006, 09:47 PM

Jesus Saves
by shopping at Wal-Mart
Everyday low prices, guaranteed!

Daddylikes · 07.10.2006, 09:49 PM

HOLY SHIT

HAHA THAT IS SO FUNNY.

Man, Cantankerous. You should take that act on the road.

Besides, everyone knows that Jesus does his savings shopping at Costco.

07.10.2006, 07:17 PM	#1
dazedcola the end of the ugly Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,075	Lee brought up a good question in "karen revisted", what do you think about that phrase ? I agree with it. Look at all the people that have died and wars that have been fought over religious beliefs. Organized religion is a dangerous thing in my mind. I understand that some people need something to believe in, but with religion comes power which can lead to violence. I think the world would be better without religion and people just living by a set of morals. __________________ "I said I didnt mean to take up all your sweet time Ill give it right back one of these days If I dont meet you no more in this world then uh Ill meet ya on the next one And dont be late " -Jimi Hendrix ...And me just another dream theory, lost inside your eye "when my mind's uncertain my body decides what it will do to get through the hell of the night as I trip on the ocean that leads through your eyes well my eyes can't wait til they finally see through you"
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 07:20 PM	#2
!@#$%! invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: mars attacks Posts: 42,460	religion killed daycare nation's brain. now look at him...
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 07:21 PM	#3
schizophrenicroom invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: behind you Posts: 10,807	if all the bullshit that went on in god's name stopped, this world would be nice. __________________ fuck i'm frustrated, freaking out something fierce, would you help me? i'm hungry and i stuffer and i startle, i struggle and i stammer til i'm up to my ears in miserable quote unquote "art"
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 07:21 PM	#4
!@#$%! invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: mars attacks Posts: 42,460	i must slobber over somebody else before i slobber over schizo again
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:00 PM	#5
SpectralJulianIsNotDead invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 7,409	Are we graduating from troll-whore-bicker-fest into political-religious-bicker fest? If so, I guess the devolution has reversed. I don't think the statement is really something I can agree or disagree with. It is sort of vague. I think Lee is trying to say something about her attitude. She is very jaded and negative. When I listen to the song, I always think about those girls that have to tell you they are athiest and how much they hate religion everytime God comes up in conversation. Then they recite the rhetoric they have read in their books that they read to seem intelligent. Like the issue of belief versus athiesm is not dependent on just themselves, but on the whole world. Does that make sense?
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:18 PM	#6
acousticrock87 invito al cielo Join Date: May 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 5,515	Mankind kills more than it saves man. Organized religion is an extremely broad concept, as there are many that have truly stood for peace and done so successfully, many that stood for peace but failed to bring it about, and many that stood for peace and achieved the opposite. Religions that actually set out to kill man are few and far between; unless you're witty and satirical - then of course anything can be made to seem so. Religion itself is not the problem, it's people involved in it. And those people don't need religion to do it. It's just a simple catalyst. Especially if you believe religion is myth - then it's obviously something that mankind is naturally drawn to. But how can anyone believe something because it makes them feel better? That's not believing, that's deluding. If I tell myself that I'm going to survive this plane crash to make myself feel better about it, that isn't actually believing that I'm going to survive - that's keeping my mind off of reality. I still know I'm probably going to die. I don't believe in religion because it makes me feel good - it doesn't. I believe in it because it makes sense.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:22 PM	#7
golden child expwy. to yr skull Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,672	opinions kill men. __________________ blind
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:39 PM	#9
Daycare Nation expwy. to yr skull Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,904	It kills the part of the man that deserves to die. __________________ That dragon ain't the love sweet love.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:40 PM	#10
nomadicfollower invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: North America Posts: 2,672	What kind of man deserves to die?
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:41 PM	#11
Daycare Nation expwy. to yr skull Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,904	I didn't say that...I said it kills that "part" of the man which deserves to die. __________________ That dragon ain't the love sweet love.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:43 PM	#12
nomadicfollower invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: North America Posts: 2,672	Which part of man deserves to die?
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:44 PM	#13
Daycare Nation expwy. to yr skull Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,904	It kills the lower self, which to most people may look like it kills more than it saves. But to the one who is saved, they are in fact dead to their old selves.... It doesn't happen all at once, it a process of growing closer to God, widening one's awareness, and allowing the false sense of "separation and divisiveness" to disappear... Which means someday I won't stoop to the level of people who attack me on message boards....but in the meantime I am imperfect. __________________ That dragon ain't the love sweet love.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:52 PM	#14
nomadicfollower invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: North America Posts: 2,672	Shedding your old, imperfect self, for a new perfect self, seems like using religion as a way to 'feel good'. What's an imperfection, though? According to the bible, man became imperfect when Adam and Eve ate the apple, right? Man became imperfect when it consulted it's conscience.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 08:59 PM	#15
Daycare Nation expwy. to yr skull Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,904	Confronting one's own faults is not "feeling good." It is realizing that one is not living up to the commandment to "love your neighbor as yourself." If by "feeling good" you mean being righteous, then I agree. Righteousness means having the right relationship to God, the world and one's self. I don't believe in original sin. I believe in karma. __________________ That dragon ain't the love sweet love.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 09:13 PM	#16
terminal pharmacy invito al cielo Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Australia Posts: 3,358	there are beautiful people in all religions, there are also evil violent people in all religions, it is not the religions it is the people. as to the world being better without religion and people just living by a set of morals (who makes the morals then, do you?) ... forget about it, this is never going to happen so forget about any utopian dreams of planet earth. we live in dystopia, we always have and always will, humans will never know peace. we must live in reality and not use certain practices as scapegoats for all of the worlds ills because it is ignorant. this is not a personal attack dazedcola just rational thought.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 09:23 PM	#17
m^a(t)h expwy. to yr skull Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,204	my friend walked in the woods yesterday and burned all his religious stuff in his room: a bible, a framed photo of jesus, a rosemary. It must have been a beautiful fire...
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 09:43 PM	#18
Daycare Nation expwy. to yr skull Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,904	You mean a Rosary. __________________ That dragon ain't the love sweet love.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 09:47 PM	#19
Cantankerous invito al cielo Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: A RETIREMENT HOME Posts: 18,499	Jesus Saves by shopping at Wal-Mart Everyday low prices, guaranteed! __________________ RETIRED
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|

07.10.2006, 09:49 PM	#20
Daddylikes the end of the ugly Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Gnome, Alaska Posts: 929	HOLY SHIT HAHA THAT IS SO FUNNY. Man, Cantankerous. You should take that act on the road. Besides, everyone knows that Jesus does his savings shopping at Costco.
	\|QUOTE AND REPLY\|