[CHOUT]

Yep, Bon Jovi and Motley Crue were my faves in my pre-punk days.

[Cantankerous]

bon jovi and motley crue didn't exist in the pre-punk days.

[youthoftomorrow]

Originally Posted by CHOUT

Yep, Bon Jovi and Motley Crue were my faves in my pre-punk days.

KSA

[UVRAY]

Originally Posted by porkmarras

Just because anger expresses itself that doesn't mean that it has anything to say much or articulately.

No, they did not articulate much of worth, nor intelligently.

But John Lydon is an extremely intelligent man. And although The Sex Pistols were not the first punk band they remain one of the most important bands in rock history. This fact is not even debateable. They are.

Someone once said you have achieved when anyone after you is compared to you and anyone preceeding you becomes redundant. I wouldn't say bands such as The Ramones are redundant at all but I would say The Sex Pistols have pretty much achieved this iconic status.

My girlfriend's son was recently sent home from school for wearing a Sex Pistols T-Shirt. No swearing on it, just a plain T-shirt with Sex Pistols written on it. 30 years later and the band is synonymous with rebellion and offence - that is just one testament to what rock n roll should be about. Bands today are cissified in comparison.

[guitarpro]

Stupid yes but one of the best ever fucki A.

[Iain]

Originally Posted by UVRAY

But John Lydon is an extremely intelligent man.

HIGHLY DEBATABLE. As far as I can see he just spews a load of rhetoric designed to make him seem intelligent. I haven't heard him say anything interesting ever I don't think. I don't tend to seek out his sage wisdom so he may have coughed up some gems while my back was turned.

Pistols are rubbish. I'm sure they would have seemed like a breath of fresh air at the time if I was around in 1977 but the fact is I wasn't.

[toxic johnny]

Yes they were like a breath of fresh air at the time... and that should never be taken away from them... their attitude was both inspirational and life changing. Their raw energy and pure nihilism was totally life affirming and vital... it's just a shame that the music has aged so badly.

[UVRAY]

Originally Posted by Iain

Pistols are rubbish. I'm sure they would have seemed like a breath of fresh air at the time if I was around in 1977 but the fact is I wasn't.

That's a really stupid thing to say.

In 30 years time and some 20 year old kid says to you "SY are shit I'm sure they were like a breath of fresh air at the time if I was around in the 80s and 90s but the fact is I wasn't."

His ignorant comments woud not change the fact that SY are one of the most influential and exciting bands of their generation.

Just as your comments regarding The Sex Pistols are totally invalid.

as far as John Lydon is concerned, he has an insight and pours scourn on the pretentiousness and hypocrisy in the music industry. He exploits it and then ridicules herd mentality.

[porkmarras]

Sure,and then he goes on to be part of the music industry and celebrity circuit himself.Now,i don't have a problem with people doing that(bills need to be paid and all that) but Lydon always smacked of someone who is deeply hypocritical when it comes to these things.As i stated before,just because you have issues that aint mean that they are any valid and this wheter you get some recognition for that or not.Sonic Youth are another kettle of fish.Also,let's not forget that PIL(wich i adore) weren't the musical child of Lydon alone.

[king_buzzo]

i dont know about you but i like them. they are areally good band and their music is not stupid

[UVRAY]

Originally Posted by porkmarras

As i stated before,just because you have issues that aint mean that they are any valid and this wheter you get some recognition for that or not.

Eeeh?

[Iain]

Originally Posted by UVRAY

That's a really stupid thing to say.

In 30 years time and some 20 year old kid says to you "SY are shit I'm sure they were like a breath of fresh air at the time if I was around in the 80s and 90s but the fact is I wasn't."

His ignorant comments woud not change the fact that SY are one of the most influential and exciting bands of their generation.

Just as your comments regarding The Sex Pistols are totally invalid.

as far as John Lydon is concerned, he has an insight and pours scourn on the pretentiousness and hypocrisy in the music industry. He exploits it and then ridicules herd mentality.

I was trying to get across the fact that I don't find them exciting because time has passed and they have dated. If I was around at the time I might have been thrilled by them and held a candle for them over the years despite their deficiencies.

Your example of Sonic Youth is a good one...I see what you mean. But I can imagine that kids in the future will say that and they'd be entitled to.

My comments about the Pistols weren't intended to 'prove' that they weren't iconic or influential (they certainly were iconic, I don't think anyone can deny that). I was just basically saying 'I don't like 'em, maybe it would have been different if I was there but I wasn't'.

[porkmarras]

Originally Posted by UVRAY

Eeeh?

Right then,tell me what coherent message the Pistols had to spread as a band.

[porkmarras]

The whole thing about having been there or not doesn't make much sense.I wasn't there when The Velvet Underground were about but i still get them,no matter what.Noone is saying here that you are not entitled to like whatever music you like.

[Iain]

No, being there isn't essential but I think being caught up in the excitement of a 'scene' helps you like stuff...if you see what I mean.

[Pookie]

I don't think it's very valid to compare Sex Pistols with SY.

Put simply, Sex Pistols were a pop band. And I don't intend that as a criticism. They didn't have a message, be it musical, political or any other.

Sex Pistols were a fashion, a fleeting moment in pop history. Their influence is undeniable, but so is Abba's (a much better comparison than SY).

And I am old enough to remember the excitement, the shock, the fear (as an 11 year old in 1977) and there is no comparison to the 25 year career of Sonic Youth, who never burst onto the scene but built up a following over a number of years, and as good as Bad Moon Rising was, my first exposure to them wasn't revolutionary in the way it was with Sex Pistols.

But Sonic Youth's music has passed the test of time and they continue to make great music.

Sex Pistols sound incredibly dated, and dare I say rather quaint these days.

[porkmarras]

Sure,but not having been there gives your opinion of a band a more merciless and objective point of view.This is obviously not implying that some of the people who were there didn't get illuminated by such a scene(after all,the Pistols WEREN'T the only band around at the time) but in retrospect you can see that their music is no more than sped up Who or Chuck Berry.

[Iain]

Originally Posted by porkmarras

Sure,but not having been there gives your opinion of a band a more merciless and objective point of view..

Yes....this is what I suppose I was trying to say. Albeit quite badly it would seem.

[Everyneurotic]

on second thought, fuck them, they did more damage than they did good, they made really great bands seem uncool and hated by most western civilization just because they knew how to play and they made a true expression of individuality into both a commercial enterprise and a fashion statement. they were reality tv before there was reality tv.

[EMMAh]

They're alright, but extremely boring after a while.
It's annoying when all the 13 year old years run around saying Sid Vicious was the hottest guy ever and thinking their oh so punk rock for listen to them.