[This Is Not Here]

Lets face it, we all probably know about a wider range of music than your average Joe. However, now and then we'll all invariably know someone who is an absolute POWERHOUSE of musical knowledge. I know several, and I suspect many of you do too. So what I want to ask in this thread is if there is a point where a person's musical knowledge becomes so absurdly broad they stop being music fans but rather music experts, or music historians?

I personally relate to and understand the desire to explore the musical spectrum, but I feel there is a point when people that do this a vast amount don't have time to really LOVE music anymore, to sit down and listen to a record until you know all it's twists and turns yet still hear something new in it everytime. I feel I know people who have forgotten the joy of discovering and loving music and it's been overtaken by the will to research and know about bands. I feel alot of this has to do with people feeling discussions with fellow music fans are competitions, somehow feeling superior when they can name-drop the best new band they've discovered, or failed if they can't.

I guess the issue here is the difference between 'knowing' and 'liking'. I know about The Cure, but I do not like them. Same with a good few bands. Maybe its justified to take a record-shop-owner approach to knowing about music you don't neccessarily like yourself- Just understand their place in the history of music. So maybe 'knowing' abbout music is justified, but I guess whats really disagreeable is passing off something you know about as something you listen too. Maybe what I'm getting at is that empty 'liking' of bands, of listing thousands of bands on your myspace and yet clearly not having taken the time to explore and grow to love or even like the band.
Quite frankly I'm not sure what I'm getting at anymore, I've confused myself, hopefully you can extract some meaning from these detatched and unstructured thoughts. Though, one thing I do know is, and remember this people, the number of bands you've heard of is directly proportional to the size of your dick. Right?

[Cantankerous]

fan.
i do not engage in elitist-music-nazi-"i listen to the most obscure music on the planet and shun anything popular even if i happen to like it because if anyone knew i liked it i wouldn't look cool" bullshit.

fuck KNOWING about a band. the only thing i care to know is if they sound good.

[atsonicpark]

A fan; and if a band I like is interesting I'll read up on them, sure.

Not sure what the point of knowing about a band is if you don't like them... and there's plenty of bands I love that I don't know a thing about. So, either way. Yeah, a fan.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U82eWptFxSs

[terminal pharmacy]

i never think about it the distinction, nor do i care to. end of sentence.

[Sheriff Rhys Chatham]

I'd like to be a music expert because I do research music in many genres but music that I like. But I'm just a fan. Though I don't know facts and band members of more than three bands maybe, if that.

[pbradley]

I don't even listen to all that many different bands. Strangely enough I know people that have considerably more records than I do yet they still seem to value my opinion on music. It's not as though "liking" music is some kind of divine epiphany that dawns on me upon first listen. Instead I have noticed that the music I like most has invariably required me to know something of the music in order to find a context that I can engage with. In this way, I am aware of a deal of bands that I have tried to understand but ultimately decided that I do not care for, and this is more often than my liking which is why I search out opinions from those I feel have a comparable taste in music. I never suggest to anyone that the bands that I know and can talk about are the same as the bands that I care to listen to. I won't consider myself an expert and I barely consider myself a fan of music (if we are going to assume music as a total instead of the idea of music itself).

As for walking music historians, I barely know of their existence apart from blogs or other third hand sources. I can just assume that they have a more general appreciation for music than I care to. Whatever floats their boat.

[Sonic Youth 37]

Fan, I enjoy music. Becoming an expert takes 99% of the fun out of it.

[Dead-Air]

I've been quoted as an expert a few times, but I always thought it was ridiculous. I'm hardly an encyclopedia of knowledge about any of my favorite artists or genres with the possible exceptions of Sun Ra and Sonic Youth, but even there so many people know so much more. In a world with Wikipedia and Google, why the fuck would anyone memorize liner notes anymore, anyway?

[fugazifan]

i know a lot compared to some but few compared to the rest.
i am studying musicology, so i will become a "music historian" but not in the sense that you meant...
plus i never belived that to be an expert you have to shun certain bands and only like obscure. i find it much more invigorating to try to find the beauty in all kinds of music, whether it be free jazz, 17th century monody, 1920s blues, or pop music.
usually there is good to be found in music....

[demonrail666]

I don't think that we need to distinguish between enjoyment and expertise. One can enrich the other. It's more down to people - some of whom are tedious in the extreme regardless of how much or little they know. You can over enjoy, just as much as you can over theorise.

[terriblecanyons]

There should be a third option to this question - a musician.
And that I am.
Though I've gotta say those elitist "I know more obscure bands than you" bitches are annoying... when you're a musician, it almost makes it okay. At least in my eyes. When you don't know bands and music history and more specifically the history to important bands, it most likely makes you look like an idiot in front of not only regular people but musicians.

[Dr. Eugene Felikson]

I am a fan. I have an adoration of music of all sorts. I love discovering new sounds, bands and musical concepts. In fact, half the reason I'm on these boards so frequently is because I have an obsession with learning more about the art form.

I'm also a musician (far from the best, but my heart is in the right place) and there's nothing I love more than a good jam session, writing a song or putting my soul on display through sound for others.

I have a friend who sees me as a fellow music afficiando, and highly respects my opinion or loves when I introduce him to new music. In all honesty, his knowledge trumps mine tenfold...BUT I really don't feel his soul is in the subject.

You can know all the random tidbits and obscure artists you want, but if you don't "get it" in the first place; it's pointless.

[terriblecanyons]

Originally Posted by Dr. Eugene Felikson

You can know all the random tidbits and obscure artists you want, but if you don't "get it" in the first place; it's pointless.

That's kind of the point I was trying to get across... Damn, I need to sleep.

[fauni gena]

why would anyone who really loves music and who's not really interested in impressing their friends or w/e pseudo-love for music bs want to be an "expert" in the way OP put it?

ppl listen to music at different rates, and even those who find and listen to new music at a fast rate listen to different records at different rates. dismissing "fast listeners" who know a lot to be obscurants is a bullshit excuse for not actually having listened to the stuff they've heard and liked

just take a recommendation, listen to the fucking record, and make up your own mind

that said, i have a lot to learn about music and am not a particularly fast listener compared to some others, but i'll never dismiss someone as being obscure

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by fauni gena

why would anyone who really loves music and who's not really interested in impressing their friends or w/e pseudo-love for music bs want to be an "expert" in the way OP put it?

Wanting to become an expert, and having some kind of need to flaunt your expertise in front of others are two different things.

[fauni gena]

right, but why would anyone who actually loves music want to become this?:

Originally Posted by This Is Not Here

a point where a person's musical knowledge becomes so absurdly broad they stop being music fans but rather music experts, or music historians?

ppl i know who tend to have an "absurdly broad" taste in music still have favorites, and i'm pretty sure they obsess over those favorites as much as anyone else does. it's just a difference in numbers of albums a person sifts through and how fast a person can come to appreciate a record

which isn't to say that ppl who listen to music slowly are any less of music fans-it's just a personal thing. but my point is that there shouldn't be a distinction in the first place

[demonrail666]

People should approach music in a way that enhances their enjoyment the most. If that involves going to libraries and wanting to find out everything about it, then fine. Equally, if that involves bouncing up and down on your bed while holding a tennis racquet, then that's fine too. Although, I've always found that the most interesting people are those that somehow try and combine the two. Adorno in one hand, Slazenger in the other.

[acousticrock87]

i really want to reply to this but im incapeable. when im sober this will be too long to read. |\

[acousticrock87]

Originally Posted by acousticrock87

i really want to reply to this but im incapeable. when im sober this will be too long to read. |\

Uhhhh...Not sure what that meant.

Anyway, I like learning about bands. Even bands I don't like. Music, for me, is a hobby, and at least knowing about the boring or unlikable parts of that hobby is of interest to me. I'm not sure why, but I just enjoy learning as much as I can about music in general.

That said, I'm definitely just a fan. I don't know that much about any specific type of music; I think I spread my interests out too much. I have a pretty good perspective of music as a whole, and can more-or-less see a cross-section of popular/nonpopular music and how it relates, but I don't know a whole lot of obscure bands. I wish I did, but it's just something I build over time.

I enjoy learning new bands, even if I don't like them, but I don't feel a driving need to. It's just fun.

[Death & the Maiden]

I'm a fan. But I'm also somewhat of an expert in my group of friends, school and family. This isn't because I know nearly everything, I just know so much more than everyone I know.