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Originally Posted by Everyneurotic
ian is (was?) in weird war, right? that band was (is?) good. i understand the garage doowop and the parodying of the genres. it sound embryonic and a bit lost with ulysses, though.
but are't nation of ulysses a post-post modern band, by your own definition? taking the piss and parodying while walloing in those same terms?
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Yes to Weird War.
I don't think they were taking the piss - I'm on very shaky territory here, but I've always had the impression they were parodying
hardcore by obviating its latent pop content... but also opening up hardcore to other ideas. Or, to my mind, injecting some sense of 'other' influences into a genre that, at its very worst, is nothing but self-congratulatory, repititious, a-musical shit. 'A-musical' isn't, in itself, a bad thing - but hardcore very often (to me, as a self-confessed non-appreciator of hardcore) seems to repeat the hallowed classics for no ostensible reason. I should qualify this - as a social phenomenon, hardcore is a great deal of fun. I've spent an amount of time at local hardcore shows, and as a live thing I can't fault it. I don't always enjoy hardcore shows musically, but I nearly always do for the social 'coming-together'. But that's entirely different to its existence as an 'art-form', in which capacity it bores me rigid, most of the time.
I think the Refused comparison is spot on - Refused have had a massive influence on the hardcore scene, mostly for shape of punk to come (I have heard This just might be the truth, by the way) which took a handful of ideas from other places - nothing avant-garde, nothing too weird, nothing exceptionally ground-breaking by comparison to someone like (ur...) SY - but a handful of ideas and somehow broke through the tepid anti-creativity of hardcore. Maybe I'm hearing the wrong hardcore (although if anyone other than Mr Neurotic wants to tell me which hardcore I should listen to - don't, I've probably heard it) but NOU do do something which the majority of hardcore I've heard entirely fails to do.
Having said all that, if NOU don't float your boat, it's really not going to make any difference to anyone or anything.