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Originally Posted by noumenal
So a "CD full of pneumatic drills and detuned guitars with feedback loops" that has "artistic value" is "experimental", but a "CD full of pneumatic drills and detuned guitars with feedback loops" that doesn't have "artistic value" is noise? Or are they both noise, but since the first has "artistic value", it's best not to call it that, because of the negative connotations of the term?
Anyway, about the birds. I love birds and read books about birdsong and stuff. But for me, art is something that humans do. Birdsong is beautiful and can be appreciated aesthetically, but it is not music. It's musical, but not music. How can birds chirping be "unmusical" and artistic at the same time? You say that birds chirping is "unmusical or dissonant", but also that it is "artistic". So is birds chirping "expiremental music" or is it "noise music"? Does it depend on the skill of the bird?
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Artistic value is in the ear of the beholder. Chuck Berry is noise to Ward Cleaver but music to Eddie Haskel. Just as Einsturzende Neubauten for example is music to me but noise to 90% of the US.
It doesn't depend on the skill of the bird. To a bird it can be music, communication, or mating calls, to you it is nothing, to someone with a headache it is noise, and to me it is music.
Noise music is an oxymoron. The only reason we call it noise is because that is what others call it. If you listen to Neubauten recreationally, you are breaking the definition of it being noise, so it would be ridiculous to call it noise. Unless of course you don't like it, but you want to listen to it because you are into "Noize" and you are purposefully making yourself feel uncomfortable and giving yourself a headache. In which case I think you should see a therapist.
Calling experimental music noise is like calling modernist art degenerate. And thats what the Nazis did, you don't want to be a Nazi do you Noumenal?