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Originally Posted by porkmarras
What about musicians outside their time,then?
Sun Ra,Moondog,Haino etc would all fall into that category.
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A more important category. I was having an argument about the 'ahead of their time' category the other day. For me, having a song-structure which is analogous to a pre-existing form doesn't make someone ahead of their time. The Sex Pistols, for instance, weren't particularly ahead of their time, but were 'different' within the context of the late-70s, so long as that context is a very narrow one. Likewise VU. I like them a lot (less so these days perhaps) but that's not because they were ahead of their time, but because they were good. Very few, perhaps none, had used their devices within a rock context, but rock isn't the sine qua non of music. Their more radical songs (say Black Angel's Death Song, All tomorrows Parties and Sister Ray) were certainly not ideas of structures that were used within electric rock, but within a wider context (looking at things like Drones out of India or the Ashkinasi [sp?]/ Romany/ Spanish/ Fado guitar tradition) they are certainly not that radical. This isn't a criticism per se, because their music is good, but I don't think it's ahead of its time. For me, something is ahead of its time if there are no forbears (hehe) to whom they can be compared. So, some of John Cage's work, bits of Wagner or Stockhausen or Schoenberg or those sorts are 'ahead of their time' in so far as they operate at the avant-garde of music. There are a load more names I could throw in. I really like Throbbing Gristle, and for me they come the closest to someone being 'ahead of their time' within the rock context, but even so they still operate within a continuum of music, albeit one several times removed from the ambit of 'rock criticism'.