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-   -   louder's hip-hop café V (http://www.sonicyouth.com/gossip/showthread.php?t=112934)

Rob Instigator 04.01.2016 02:57 PM

in Jazz scene of 1915-1970's, hipster was someone who was down with the Jazz, and it was NOT derogatory in any way.

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 04.01.2016 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
in Jazz scene of 1915-1970's, hipster was someone who was down with the Jazz, and it was NOT derogatory in any way.

This ain't the 1920s Jazz scene. Don't get caught up in the semantics you know EXACTLY what we are talking about

Rob Instigator 04.01.2016 03:35 PM

it is all a continuum. Nothing ends, nothing begins out of thin air.

Hipster used to be what squares called the freaks. They were HIP to shit that the Norms were and are not hip to.

Then, for some twisted reason, the hipsters themselves decided to use the term to denigrate those they considered POSERS. How or why that happened would be a neat ethnological inquiry, but it is what happened.

word meanings change, due to the ignorance of the humans uttering them, or due to a purposeful attempt to re-define the word.

Every single person on this SY Gossip forum is a goddamned hipster!

Severian 04.01.2016 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
Haha not me. Not the least bit. Indeed i am by definition anti-hipster in every way. And ill talk plenty of shit too


Ok maybe you're the sole exception.

Still, the mere fact that you Sonic Youth and Sleater-Kinney are two of your favorite bands would have been enough to earn you a hipster label back in the day.

I'm not sure what it means now. It's obviously an insult, but it hasn't always been one. It was once synonymous with "scenester," even before that phrase was really coined. Bottom line, if you dig indie rock, then you have some hipster in your DNA. That seems to be the one constant through the ages. Love of underground music and art and film and literature. But mostly music.

I'm just saying, tossing around a term like that on a Sonic Youth board is the very epitome of glass house stone throwing. So anyone trying to throw shade by using that term around these parts should really check theyself.

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 04.01.2016 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Severian
Ok maybe you're the sole exception.

Still, the mere fact that you Sonic Youth and Sleater-Kinney are two of your favorite bands would have been enough to earn you a hipster label back in the day.

I'm not sure what it means now. It's obviously an insult, but it hasn't always been one. It was once synonymous with "scenester," even before that phrase was really coined. Bottom line, if you dig indie rock, then you have some hipster in your DNA. That seems to be the one constant through the ages. Love of underground music and art and film and literature. But mostly music.


But scenster is an insult too! The common theme whether hipster or scenster is that the people are only interested in the scene and not genuinely interested in the art. I don't know about yall but every single show i went to and every single track in my music library is because of my sincere love of THE ART and not being seen on the scene. SY always felt like an anti-scene scene.. sure SK were darlings of music magazines BUT here in LA the shows didn't feel like a scenster band until 2005 and yes, at the reunion show.

Severian 04.01.2016 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louder
The most ironic thing is that HE is probably much closer to Kid Rock than Kanye..


It's an absurd comparison, so yeah you're probably right. It's goddamn absurd. You know what rapper is comparable to Kid Rock? Eminem. But what the fuck IS Kid Rock anymore? Fucking classic rock for middle aged Midwesterners. Who the fuck talks about Kid fucking Rock anymore? Who ever did?

Actually, that guy is such a traditionalist, that even when he "embraces" hip hop he can't make it past the '80s. He's ⅓ Lynyrd Skynyrd, ⅓ Hank Williams Jr. and ⅓ Run DMC AT HIS MOST MUSICALLY DIVERSE. Usually he's just the rap-rock Ted Nugent.

Kanye is not a traditionalist in any sense. He doesn't believe in yesterday. Everything he does, for better or worse, is something new. The only thing he has in common with Kid Rock is money, which I'm only guessing Kid Rock still has... Who the fuck knows? What is this, 1999? Who's kid rock?

Severian 04.01.2016 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
But scenster is an insult too! The common theme whether hipster or scenster is that the people are only interested in the scene and not genuinely interested in the art. I don't know about yall but every single show i went to and every single track in my music library is because of my sincere love of THE ART and not being seen on the scene. SY always felt like an anti-scene scene.. sure SK were darlings of music magazines BUT here in LA the shows didn't feel like a scenster band until 2005 and yes, at the reunion show.


Yeah, but that's a misconception. We all know we genuinely love the music we love. We probably all have gone through phases of following a herd in one way or another, but if other folks think we still do that, it's only because that behavior is so second nature to them that they think it must apply to everyone.

I don't see it as an insult. When I say we all have a little hipster in us, I just mean we all share a love of underground music and indie culture (to varying degrees). That's all.

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 04.01.2016 05:06 PM

Again. I don't know about yall but here in LA hipster don't love art or music they only love being part of the "scene" and being seen in the "scene"

Its a disingenuous lifestyle. If yall want to be called hipster because you listen to indie music fine, but i will never associate with that label and will ALWAYS diss it because at least in LA hipsters are fake. They don't care about the art. I care ONLY about the art. I could care less about the scene.

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 04.01.2016 05:09 PM

I didn't call any of you hipsters or scensters. If yall want to call yourselves that fine, but if you come to LA and see actual fake ass hipsters you may not want to call yourselves such or be rven remotely mistaken as such

Severian 04.01.2016 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
it is all a continuum. Nothing ends, nothing begins out of thin air.

Hipster used to be what squares called the freaks. They were HIP to shit that the Norms were and are not hip to.

Then, for some twisted reason, the hipsters themselves decided to use the term to denigrate those they considered POSERS. How or why that happened would be a neat ethnological inquiry, but it is what happened.

word meanings change, due to the ignorance of the humans uttering them, or due to a purposeful attempt to re-define the word.

Every single person on this SY Gossip forum is a goddamned hipster!


Yes!

Severian 04.01.2016 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
I didn't call any of you hipsters or scensters. If yall want to call yourselves that fine, but if you come to LA and see actual fake ass hipsters you may not want to call yourselves such or be rven remotely mistaken as such


Ditto for Seattle. Except folks out there have this amazing ability to make even the hippest hipster feel unhip. It's very hard to age emotionally in that city, where pedigree and social status are unbelievably important for such a "progressive" area... It's just part of the fucking cultural DNA.

and I know y'all know what Portland is like. (Spoiler: Portlandia is actually pretty goddamn dead on)

I'm just saying, these days maybe it's an insult. But used here, among us -- a bunch of white nerdy Sonic Youth fans in their 30's -- it really shouldn't be. And I want to clarify that if I ever use the word to apply to "us," I don't mean it in the negative way.

Severian 04.01.2016 08:12 PM

I just spent $20 on an album that I already have three versions of on my iPod by the way. Starting to question the sanity of that decision. But whatever, it's official now. Severian one, white guilt zero. For the day.

Skuj 04.01.2016 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Severian
I just spent $20 on an album that I already have three versions of on my iPod by the way. Starting to question the sanity of that decision. But whatever, it's official now. Severian one, white guilt zero. For the day.

What if he changes it again to something that you don't like as much as the version you just spent $20 on?

Severian 04.01.2016 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuj
What if he changes it again to something that you don't like as much as the version you just spent $20 on?


Like I said, I actually think the download will allow for that. But if not, I'll listen to the Spotify version, or visit this site called Pirate Bay that I hear is kind of a thing. ;)

It's my duty as a superfan, bro. I probably won't spend another $20 on the digital version (it actually hasn't arrived in my inbox yet.... it says to allow up to 12 hours for "delivery," which is weird I guess but fuckit) but if a hard copy comes out I will also purchase that.

I bought Kendrick Lamar's untitled unmastered. the morning it was released. Then the moment I saw it on the shelves, I bought it again on CD. That actually kind of pissed me off because there's nothing in that CD case except for a completely blank single piece of card stock paper. I was hoping for some photos, a liner note or two, but I knew the risk.

I'm a completist when it comes to artists in my pantheon. Sonic Youth, VU, Kanye, Richard D. James, Unwound, DJ Koze, Lips, etc. I buy everything, multiple times if necessary.

$20 is not that much money. Even though all it really bought me here was a feeling of officiality.

louder 04.02.2016 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Severian
It's an absurd comparison, so yeah you're probably right. It's goddamn absurd. You know what rapper is comparable to Kid Rock? Eminem. But what the fuck IS Kid Rock anymore? Fucking classic rock for middle aged Midwesterners. Who the fuck talks about Kid fucking Rock anymore? Who ever did?

Actually, that guy is such a traditionalist, that even when he "embraces" hip hop he can't make it past the '80s. He's ⅓ Lynyrd Skynyrd, ⅓ Hank Williams Jr. and ⅓ Run DMC AT HIS MOST MUSICALLY DIVERSE. Usually he's just the rap-rock Ted Nugent.

Kanye is not a traditionalist in any sense. He doesn't believe in yesterday. Everything he does, for better or worse, is something new. The only thing he has in common with Kid Rock is money, which I'm only guessing Kid Rock still has... Who the fuck knows? What is this, 1999? Who's kid rock?

Right. And the way he stated that absurd opinion as a fact is even more concerning. From what I've gathered, guest compared him to Kid Rock because Kanye claimed to be the greatest living "rockstar" during Yeezus era, which guest found laughable because he's a white guy who grew up on rock music and feels like he owns the genre. Which is ridiculous in itself because rock actually started by black people.

If we're being real, Yeezus is closer to a rockstar album than most actual rock stars this decade, in terms of aesthetic, messaging and sound.. the whole album rollout, you know? The energy and the spirit were there.

Kanye may come across as weird, ridiculous and even completely delusional at times, but don't forget that people used to laugh at him when he said he's gonna start his own solo rap career and become more than just a producer. Kanye's confidence is the only reason he got this far.

louder 04.02.2016 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Severian
I'm just saying, tossing around a term like that on a Sonic Youth board is the very epitome of glass house stone throwing. So anyone trying to throw shade by using that term around these parts should really check theyself.

Like I said, I just tend to use that word jokingly as a synonym for "edgy" and "contrarian." Probably shouldn't have because it caused a lot of confusion but yeah.. it wasn't that serious.

louder 04.02.2016 04:21 AM

I'm feelin' the new A. Ham!

 


A good mixture of soul ballads, rock, funk and hip hop influences..

guest 04.02.2016 04:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louder
Right. And the way he stated that absurd opinion as a fact is even more concerning. From what I've gathered, guest compared him to Kid Rock because Kanye claimed to be the greatest living "rockstar" during Yeezus era, which guest found laughable because he's a white guy who grew up on rock music and feels like he owns the genre. Which is ridiculous in itself because rock actually started by black people.

If we're being real, Yeezus is closer to a rockstar album than most actual rock stars this decade, in terms of aesthetic, messaging and sound.. the whole album rollout, you know? The energy and the spirit were there.

Kanye may come across as weird, ridiculous and even completely delusional at times, but don't forget that people used to laugh at him when he said he's gonna start his own solo rap career and become more than just a producer. Kanye's confidence is the only reason he got this far.

jesus fucking christ......backtrack a couple of pages to where the comment originally was and you were all circle jerking over kanye equating him to various rock stars. comparison drawn between him and lou reed but it's pretty obvious he's in no respects comparable to lou reed so I posited that he was closer to fucking kid rock whereas keith occupies the lou reed role, despite obvious differences. get a fucking sense of humour man...



also....."guest found laughable because he's a white guy who grew up on rock music and feels like he owns the genre"......do you have any sort of idea as to the amount of bullshit contained within this sentence, none of which is in any way verifiable from your perspective? realise who you're speaking with before you throw these absurd projections out there, I mean I would guess you're a spotty fucking accountant who clings to his youth via attaching himself to a culture with which he has no tangible connection whatsoever and wanks in parks on smoko but hey can't verify that one can we so I don't spew it onto a goddamn screen.







///listen to babyfather

louder 04.02.2016 04:48 AM

Sorry but when you compare Kanye to fucking Kid Rock, I can't help but think of racism. "A black guy can't be a respectable rock star." It's probably not what you were thinking, but that's how you came across. I understand you were just fooling around now though.

louder 04.02.2016 05:05 AM

I must've missed the Kanye circle jerk.. I've had tons of criticism towards his last album and his attitude on Twitter recently. I'm a fan but definitely not a blind follower.


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