I’m sorry, “evil?”

Are you joking? Being ironic? Or do you really see the world like this. Good and evil, and “we choose to buckle up?”

Also faulty analogy, guns and seatbelts. You have to be joking right now.

Huh. I guess I believe you. I’ve only driven through the state, so I don’t know shit.

Well, fuck it all then.

I’m as 100% honest as I know how to be......evil is a very real thing!

Someone who chooses to dress in black tactical gear, enters a small country church on a easy Sunday morning and kills kids as young as five, they are evil.

YES - someone choosing to bring harm or death to an individual or group is evil......it’s an evil act!!!

“I mean it was just strictly acting on what the right thing to do was,” Langendorff said.” ......this is such a Texas way of thinking, a way of life!

How?







......and more importantly, why?

Because this is a religion thread and most folks here are openly against it, and I thought you might be being cute with the binary morality statements, which bear a striking resemblance to the black and white of religio-speak.

I agree that things like what happened in Texas are hard to describe as anything other than “evil.” Seriously. Vegas too. So many other things. But I don’t think one can make the argument that strapping up to fight said “evil” with the instruments used to commit said acts is, like, *good.* Huge moral leap there. Huge logical leap top. There’s no binary logic to apply to this. Arming people to fight the armed people is not any kind of solution to any kind of problem.

And there are multiple problems here. One is that “bad” people with bad intentions are hurting other people. Another is that those people have access to weapons to help them. Another problem is that said weapons exist, and we as a society very obviously do not yet m kw how to handle them. So I just take strong issue with the “we need more armed citizens” response.

That is literally the last thing anyone needs, and perhaps the most counter-intuitive solution to the problem that I can even imagine.

and yet that myth is at the center of american ideology— especially on the right



this was the favorite tv program of leo strauss, intellectual godfather to the neocons who led both reagan’s and dubya’s foreign policies.

have you ever watched “the power of nightmares”? great documentary. a bit propaganda-style, sure, but... so eye-opening.



ronnie raygun vs the evil empire
dubya vs the axis of evil knievel

No, never seen the nightmare thing, but I’ll seek it out.
But I know, absolutely, that this is how the “right” (ugh.) thinks.

Which is why it surprises me to hear this logic (non-logic) coming from Bytor. Apparently without irony.

This is how religion is damaging.
This is how it’s dangerous. This kind of thinking being applied to complex sociological and political problems, or, fuck’s sake, women’s health issues, is truly damaging.

I’m prepared to say that it takes an under-developed mind to subscribe to these beliefs in an absolutist way.

and how did you prepare yourself? had a drink, felt angry, and spewed a narcissistic put-down? impressive...

ps- didnt know you were a zoroastrian scholar

So I represent non-logic?

I thought this would be a thread of discussion, not everyone agreeing, but some solid back and forth.


There is no argument, not here in Texas......it’s a way of life! I’m not talking about people walking around “strapped” playing Wild Wild West. It’s a reality that a great many Texans own guns, especially women. We’ve always had the right to carry a consealed weapon in your vehicle when traveling from point A to point B. No license required to own a gun, none of my guns are registered and I’m 100% legal. Guess I should point out that I haven’t purchased a gun in over 30 years.


Symbols understands......rural areas of Texas are vast and many. Most don’t have local Sheriffs Departments, just a Constable who is responsible for hundreds of miles. But honestly, that doesn’t matter as those in the City have the same rights.

Last week in New York someone ran over innocent people while shouting, allahu akbar. No one crying about new restrictions on who can rent vans, and please be sure you understand in NO WAY does this Muslim represent all Muslims.

But when a lone Wolfe shoots up a church, let’s change the Constitution and lump law abiding citizens into some sort of republican hate group, brand them as being non-logic.

this is exactly why i got pissed at severian’s post.

and this is why liberals fail— because rather than trying to understand and/or persuade their opponents they call them stupid.

“if you were smart, you’d agree with me”

well, if you’re so smart, why can’t you listen to your opponents, and understand them, and come up with a compelling argument that speaks to them?

preaching to the choir is no great feat.

and agreement is not a compliment.

Yeah, ok, I got angry and said stupid shit. I do apologize because nobody will ever understand anyone if the only things that are said or intimated are “you don’t get it.” Yes liberals fail at this constantly.

Smarter people should be able to listen to opinions even when they don’t like them and relate to the people they speak to. Obviously I can’t do that, so clearly not very smart.

Apologies for being a dick Bytor.

Just to be clear though, I am not in favor of changing the constitution. I am not in favor of taking away gun rights. I’m on the ball enough to understand that’s no kind of answer either, and I don’t believe I’ve ever made any mention of that being a solution to any problem.

I just support stricter checks, tests perhaps, and so on. More oversight about who can get a gun. NOT eliminating the second amendment, or anything close to that. I’m not a crazy knee-jerk liberal. As I said, I may personally hate guns, but I am politically *not anti-gun* Hope that makes sense.

internet hi fives, amigo

now let’s try to resume the talk about ideas

the idea of a cosmic struggle between good and evil is both ancient and thoroughly developed

it’s in many religions, it’s in superhero comics (yes), it’s in laws and judicial systems, etc.

when we talk about guns in america we’re really discussing metaphysics, value systems, etc

eta: i heard this the other day on ennpeearr: https://www.ted.com/talks/jonathan_h...the_moral_mind

eta, again: sorry that was the wrong dude. this is the right one:

https://www.ted.com/talks/robb_wille...onversat ions

it’s in the oct 27 “ted radio hour” show: https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510298/ted-radio-hour

I mostly get annoyed by anyone who claims morals only come from a book labeled "the bible"

"Evil" and "Good" are a dichotomy, and didactic thought tends to lead to Aristotlean emphasis on yes/no, omitting the all-important other options of "Maybe" and "I Don't Know."

I think evil exists, because people exist and we all have that capability.

I think good exists, because people exist and we all have that capability.

I think animals/plants/fungi/algae/bacteria/viruses do not give a flying fuck about good/evil. the world gets along fine without humans and without our ideas of what is good or what is evil.

an animal/plant/fungus/algae/bacteria/virus will kill or wait for death to feed and survive. that is not evil, right? It is the nature of things that life feeds on life.

an animal (dolphins/orcas/cats/dogs/monkees/chimps) will also torture or kill another animal just for fun/entertainment/boredom. Is that evil? How can it be evil if the animal in question is unaware of it's own consciousness, much less the other animals' consciousness?

Humans have forethought, at least a capacity for it that is greater than any other creature we have found. We know what our actions will entail, how they will help or hurt someone. we choose to do good. we choose to do evil. There is not a human alive that has not wished death up[on an enemy or a foe or a hated person. The difference between a "good" human and a "bad" human seems to be that a good human understands the thought is just a thought, and to act upon it is selfish and bad. The "bad" humans will entertain such thoughts and go ahead and plan them and carry them out.

There is very little difference between these two humans. the ony difference is their CHOICE to act.

abusers, molesters, rapists, killers, etc, for the most part, choose to do what they do. That choice, that moment when they decide to actually act upon those desires, is what shows true EVIL.

I didn’t used to believe in evil. Not really. Too programmed by a science-heavy education. Even as a young Catholic-Ish teen, I had reservations about good and evil.

Now I’m pretty sure I believe in evil. I don’t think human beings are simple enough organisms to be reduced to one thing or another, but actions certainly can be, I think. Rape, evil. Genocide, evil. Hatred based on superficial things like appearance or sexual preference, evil. A wish to inflict harm on others, often probably evil... sometimes simply compulsive. Sometimes a bit of both. My take anyway. And my take is in constant flux.

I’m a little foggier on what’s good. Again I blame the science.

I think any kind of absolutist value system is counterproductive to society. Extremism is counterproductive to society.

I’m an extremely analytical thinker, so I’m almost COMPLETELY INCAPABLE of coming to actual conclusions about things. Always trying to look at other sides of issues I think I understand, which I find and then un-understand in the process.

Just typing now.

We all know Drumpf said he'd date Ivanka if she weren't his daughter — now, has anyone here seen THIS shit from 2003?

WW: Ivanka, what's the favorite thing you have in common with your father?

IT: Either real estate or golf.

WW: Donald?

DT: Well, I was gonna say SEX...

this is too fuckin funny. dennis' faith speech from always sunny
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoM2657e7bI

Evo Morales and Bolivia. New law for anti-proselytizing and allowing abortion

http://www.joemygod.com/2018/01/18/b...proselytizing/

lol @ evo president for life

caudillismo lives on.

might be a little more complicated than your simplicity suggests

pffttttttt

he wants to run for a fourth term after he was told no by referendum

no amount of overcomplicated sophistry can hide that essential fact

latin america has an extensive history of presidents-for-life — from dr. francia to fidel and now the chavez-maduro 2-backed beast (plus 70+ years of pri dedazo now rising again)

for a poetic hallucination of this long-established tradition check out ggm’s the autumn of the patriarch

history man! and backs it up with A NOVEL!

seriously evo should not run for a fourth term

i appreciate such liberal pursuits as his disengagement from imf/world bank and the us war on drugs, and his laissez-faire approach to the informal economy, but this messianic approach to politics always backfires and just fucking no.

bolivia needs a government of laws and institutions, not charismatic leaders.

well, i belive in positive vibes! i mean why does any one visit church,temple
because they belive in getting a good vibe going there. so what if you do good and feel good ,that might help you feel positive and also a feel that god might be inside you and we dont need to search him anywhere Tutuapp 9Apps Latest Version showbox

Regarding SCOTUS announcement upcoming....at what point would a sincerely held religious belief preclude service as a judge? I've thought of this a number of times regarding freedom of religion. There are some real gen-yoo-wine religions that have some pretty odd tenets. I am sure there are many ISIL members that are as sincere in their religious beliefs as Ms Coney-Barrett...and a whole bunch of Asatrus you can find (by tattoo) in just about any prison. Want a few of these cats on the court?

Many people associate religion with morals = The Ten Commandments

Having Judges who are impartial and of sound moral character is imperative!

Checking your political parties wants/needs/bias at the Supreme Court door is a must!!

I believe America is better off because Hillary Clinton isn’t nominating her second Supreme Court Justice today.

There is no point at which religious beliefs should preclude or determine decisions as a judge. No point.

If I had my way, I’d only vote for declared agnostics, as that’s the only sane option. All elected officials and appointed officials should be able to separate their beliefs from their job. If they can’t, they’re unqualified. In my opinion.

Yeah, I k is this means like 98% of the nation’s politicians would be “unqualified,” but so be it. Also, duh.

waiting for spam insertion in 3, 2, 1....

Organized Religion is how the truly powerful and wealthy control the rest of us, like parents controlling their children with tales of Santa Claus, The Tooth Fairy, or the Three Kings (for Latinos). In no way do the truly powerful and wealthy actually believe or practice what they ask of us to believe and practice, same as parents who ask kids to be good for Santa but could give a fuck about being good themselves, cuz they know they made up the idea of Santa.

the TEACHINGS of enlightened humans (The Buddha, Emmanuel who is called Jesus the Christ, Confucius, Mohammed, Abraham, Moses, etc.) are all that truly matter, for they show us how to live in love and how to live in peace with the amazing world we are all part of.

Priests/pastors/rabbis/Imam's etc. can all go fuck themselves. They are the slave-owners and plantation masters of our collective spirituality, and they use it for their own ends.

BTW, if you actually read what Emmanuel who is called Jesus the Christ said, he spoke very clearly about how a truly good human needs to disavow all familial ties (for family can force you to be evil to protect the "family"), all organized religious ties (for religion seeks to force you to think as they decide, with no room for personal connection to the divine without some pedophile intermediary), and all ties to nationality (Render unto Ceasar what is Ceasars. Nations are all false ideas, which keep us separate and make us think we are better than the humans on the other side of the river.)

They killed Emmanuel who is called Jesus the Christ because of this. He drew forth followers from all races, all "religions", all nationalities. The Hebrew priests/rabbis derided Jesus because he preached to GREEKS! GREEKS!! Oh my!

religion is a fucking load of shit.

of course this is just one man's opinion

Jailhouse Rap Houston: Kanye and his choir performed inside the Harris County jail

Monotheism in all forms is a cancer

I have been having a number of personal revelations. I think my interest in Judaism is actually a calling. Shabbat this morning hit me wave after wave. I get the wilderness now. I was led into the wilderness by god so he could starve and dehydrate me. I needed to starve. I found the tent.

if that wasn't so sad, it would be funny

Generals gathered in their masses, just like witches at black masses.

Also I have a few manifestos in me about the myriad of hypocritical blasphemies committed in the process of rationalizing christianity using judaism as a basis for advocating it's distinct doctrine. The best intentioned christians cant navigate the cognitive dissonance of anti semitism being it's foundation and core while pretending to be approving of it by ggggwwco-opting and manipulating its message.

Holy christ. As i was typing this i man was privately in a conversation saying incredibly incredibly scary anti semitic shit

I felt compelled to bolt

Not fun