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-   -   louder's hip-hop café V (http://www.sonicyouth.com/gossip/showthread.php?t=112934)

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 02.27.2016 03:12 AM

Sighs. Youre drunk severian go home

Severian 02.27.2016 12:13 PM

You know man, MJ doesn't exactly have the world's best reputation. Not sure if you remember, like, every year between 1993 and his death, but he had kind of a bad run there at the end. It's weird how nobody talks about the multiple child molestation accusations, the weird ass marriages, the WTF child names, the bastardizations of the English language, the thousand masochistic plastic surgeries, the dangling baby... When he died, he just *poof* disappeared off of the world's naughty list, which he dominated for nearly 20 years.

I have nothing against his music, because I'm pretty good at separating the personality from the art itself. But I'm not sure he would have ever redeemed himself in the public eye if he hadn't passed. He was the face of "creepy and weird" in America for so damn long. I just want to throw that out there in case you forgot that it was long considered a major insult to be compared to MJ.

Just saying.

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 02.27.2016 02:38 PM

Dude. You're totally pushing me towards leaving this forum. You can enjoy Kanye all you want, BUT YOU DAMN WELL FUCKING KNOW THAT KAYNE HIMSELF WOULDN'T EVEN REMOTELY COMPARE HIMSELF TO THE COSMIC FORCE THAT WAS MICHAEL JACKSON.


Here is my only olive branch. Carry on.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz...#ixzz41BpA0o2Z

 

I don't know if kanye was Chrismated into my Oriental Orthodox Church when he was marriedwhich is traditionally the custom, BUT his children are baptized into my family and i applaud this. Who knows, maybe they will rub off on him

Severian 02.27.2016 07:46 PM

Uhh... Wow. Calm down. Listen to/read my words, my friend: I already said this was not a value judgment. This isn't about how much I like Kanye. I tried to extend my own olive branch by saying I was just making a comparison between the uniqueness of the artists with respect to their relationship to their peers, not between the artists themselves.

By the way, Kanye HAS compared himself to Michael Jackson. He loves MJ. Childhood hero. Massive influence. And he's compared himself to MJ more times than I can remember.

If you're actually going to get mad about this, then that's your call. I'm not saying the artists are similar, I'm not saying they're equals, and I'm not saying they're alike in any way other than that nobody else is really like either one of them.

I have listened to you bad mouth the fuck out of Kanye over and over again for years now, and I'm fine with it. You're telling me you can't handle me using Kanye's and Michael's names in the same sentence or you'll pack up your toys and leave? Well, then you're a hypocrite and you're expecting me to do what you will not.

I grew up with MJ too. He was the first artist to mean anything to me on an individual level. The first artist I found some identity in. The Beatles I knew through my father. MJ was my thing when I was a kid and the meant the world to me. I cried when he got his ass beat by Joe Pesci in Moonwalker

I may not still be a total devotee (became more of a Prince guy somewhere along the line), but MJ is without question the absolute King of Pop. The only artist that could compare to the Beatles in terms of influence and quality of output and popularity. So CHILL. Or, if you can't tolerate my extremely non-offensive (and, considering how much I love Kanye) quite complementary half-comparison of the two artists, and you expect me to walk on eggshells while you constantly rip on one of my favorite artists, then do whatever you like.

Severian 02.27.2016 07:55 PM

This is absurd. You compared Kanye to Donald Fucking Trump! I responded without losing my shit, because I get that you and I have different tastes, and don't always agree, but I respect you and I respect your intellect and your contribution to the discussions we have here.

I've never been the type to rank *people* but if I had to rank the people on this forum that I enjoy interacting with the most, you'd be right up there with louder, NR, Rob Instigator, Slambang (symbols), and p-green aka all those other names he's had. You're free to express your opinions to me without making me angry, and I enjoy respectfully disagreeing with you. Obviously the respect does not go both ways or you wouldn't be acting like this. Super bummed out man. Super bummed out.

louder 02.28.2016 05:22 AM

Here's a confession: At the peak of my Kanye fandom, I listened to Off the Wall, Thriller and Bad back to back.. and thought to myself "Michael truly is the greatest. Kanye isn't on his level."

louder 02.28.2016 05:30 AM

It is a weird comparsion though. Kanye obviously doesn't have MJ's talents as a performer, but sitting through his discography will reveal that he's doubtlessly a genius producer.

louder 02.28.2016 05:39 AM

Now imagine MJ over a chipmunk soul beat from Kanye. Could've been so good.

Severian 02.28.2016 09:55 AM

I used to love Bad. But honestly that's kind of where I draw the line at this point. I'm way more into Off the Wall and Thriller.

But I never really came back to MJ after the '90s. Doesn't change the fact that his music changed my life and my world view.

Severian 02.28.2016 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louder
Here's a confession: At the peak of my Kanye fandom, I listened to Off the Wall, Thriller and Bad back to back.. and thought to myself "Michael truly is the greatest. Kanye isn't on his level."


You don't have to "confess" that man. Kanye may have compared himself to MJ, but I think he meant it in more of a "hey, I'm like the MJ of rap" kind of way. Because obviously (very very obviously) Michael Jackson had skills as a vocalist and an entertainer that are totally missing from Kanye's entire schtick. I really don't think they're comparable on an artistic level at all. Now, I may prefer to listen to the music of Kanye West at this point in my life (and I do) but MJ had this ability to unite people from all over the world in a way that Kanye has only done in extreme miniature.

So again, I'm not saying the two are alike. I'm just saying they're both singular.

Severian 02.28.2016 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louder
Now imagine MJ over a chipmunk soul beat from Kanye. Could've been so good.


A collaboration between the two would have been absolutely morhetfucking epic, for 100% certain. Probably would have been a massive hit too. Although I can just as easily hear MJ over a more WTT/MBDTF style maximalist track.

Severian 02.28.2016 10:14 AM

Kim looks insanely beautiful in her Virgin Mary getup in that photo. Kanye ... looks... ah... well, can't say full body all white long johns are what I'd wear to my child's baptism, but whatever.

louder 02.28.2016 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Severian
A collaboration between the two would have been absolutely morhetfucking epic, for 100% certain. Probably would have been a massive hit too. Although I can just as easily hear MJ over a more WTT/MBDTF style maximalist track.

Hmm kinda like The Weeknd's Tell Your Friends? Yeah, that would've been epic. I can totally see it.

Speaking of Tell Your Friends, the album version kills the video/single version. Kanye's vocoder effect thing and Mike Dean's guitar solo gave me the same goosebumps I felt when MBDTF came out.

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 02.28.2016 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louder
Here's a confession: At the peak of my Kanye fandom, I listened to Off the Wall, Thriller and Bad back to back.. and thought to myself "Michael truly is the greatest. Kanye isn't on his level."

That is all i am saying. And you didn't even factor in how MJ is the greatest dancer in human history.

Severian 02.28.2016 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
That is all i am saying. And you didn't even factor in how MJ is the greatest dancer in human history.


Yeah. See, as a performer there's no topping MJ. Prince didn't do that shit. And this may be far fetched, but the way I see it nobody has had a bigger impact on hip-hop culture than Michael Jackson. They just don't make them like that anymore.

SuchFriendsAreDangerous 02.28.2016 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Severian
Yeah. See, as a performer there's no topping MJ. Prince didn't do that shit. And this may be far fetched, but the way I see it nobody has had a bigger impact on hip-hop culture than Michael Jackson. They just don't make them like that anymore.

See was that so hard?

Severian 02.28.2016 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous
See was that so hard?


Aaaack!!

Rob Instigator 02.29.2016 10:54 AM

Trying for days to get Future/Ty Dollar Sign tickets for the Purple Reign Tour. The fucking tickets START at $189 each!!!!! Jesus fuck! I did not pay that much to see Tony Bennett at Jones Hall in downtown Houston!!!!!

How does anyone go to live shows anymore when they cost so much? What a fucking rip-off.

I wouldn't pay over $100 to see ANYONE, not even Sonic Youth. No 90 minutes of music is worth that....

Severian 02.29.2016 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Instigator
Trying for days to get Future/Ty Dollar Sign tickets for the Purple Reign Tour. The fucking tickets START at $189 each!!!!! Jesus fuck! I did not pay that much to see Tony Bennett at Jones Hall in downtown Houston!!!!!

How does anyone go to live shows anymore when they cost so much? What a fucking rip-off.

I wouldn't pay over $100 to see ANYONE, not even Sonic Youth. No 90 minutes of music is worth that....


Jesus. That is a ridiculous price, especially for a mini tour taking place around the release of a failed mixtape. What the hell?

I've paid $100 or more to see bands in the past. The Rolling Stones for one. But I would never pay that much to see artists on the level of Future or Ty$. That seems like it should be closer to $15-$20 territory honestly. Wow. I would absolutely pay $100+ to see Sonic Youth again, or to see Kanye. But I can't believe anyone would pay that much to see two artists who've released so much of their music free over the internet. That's more expensive than it was to go to the first Pitchfork music festival in Chicago! Fuck that noise, man.

Rob Instigator 03.01.2016 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Severian
Jesus. That is a ridiculous price, especially for a mini tour taking place around the release of a failed mixtape. What the hell?

I've paid $100 or more to see bands in the past. The Rolling Stones for one. But I would never pay that much to see artists on the level of Future or Ty$. That seems like it should be closer to $15-$20 territory honestly. Wow. I would absolutely pay $100+ to see Sonic Youth again, or to see Kanye..


I grew up during the 80's when the punk and independent bands did their own thing and kept prices low at the door. I absolutely HATED going to see Nine Inch Nails and seeing that they were selling shitty fucking t-shirts for $45 (in 1992 dollars!) What a rip-off. No entertainer is worth that bullshit.

For around a decade and a half I would not go to any shows that cost more than $20 for a ticket, and I got to see Mr. Bungle, Fugazi, Dinosaur, Sonic Youth, Mudhoney, Nirvana, RHCP, Skinny Puppy, MInistry, etc., not to mention countless smaller acts.

The only reason I deigned to pay $100 a ticket to go see an octogenarian was because my wife has been a lifelong Tony Bennett fan and she had never seen him perform...


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